Ali has set official visits to UCLA (Aug. 31) & Louisville (Sept. 6).
Peach Jam Footage
Come on Prince… Let’s get that michigan visit scheduled
I really don’t know what a UM fans response to this would be other than this aint good. The quotes out there don’t bode well.
Bottom line for me is this…for whatever reason we haven’t been hitting home runs in the recruiting world for the past 2 years…thus far. Still time for the 15s and we certainly seem to be knocking on the door for the 16s. I think part of this is because of JB’s deliberate/conservative approach to recruiting, partly because there is a complete lack of talent in the state of Michigan, partly because UM still isn’t seen as a powerhouse program on a national basis, and partly because A2 doesn’t really have a fun atmosphere if we’re being honest.
The beautiful part of this is simple…JB has proven that he can essentially take a mid-major recruit and turn him into a legitimate big ten player in some instances, and make lottery picks out of lower tier high major recruits. However, at some, point, I do believe we have to upgrade the raw talent (especially in terms of athleticism) in order to consistently compete for Final 4 contention.
Winning cures all…I’ll say it again - 2 more consecutive sweet 16s and I truly believe we will start getting serious consideration every year from elite/high end recruits.
I’m with ya on most of it… But A2 doesn’t have a fun atmosphere? It’s one of the best college towns in the country
Well, if you don’t want to mention the elephant in the room that’s fine, but we’re not competing on equal footing with some of these schools (and I’d definitely throw Louisville and UCLA into that mix). As far as the “complete lack of talent” in the state of Michigan, I don’t agree. Derrick Walton. Jaylen Johnson. Eric Davis. Cassius Winston. Miles Bridges. Brian Bowen. Josh Jackson. Possibly Xavier Tillman from the 2017 class. The issue is that some if not many of these kids are not recruitable.
During the time that we were willing to do what it takes to get all the very top recruits, we did. The Fab Five. The Fresh Five. A three man class of all McDonalds All Americans (Traylor, Bullock, White). From 1991-1995, we recruited with anyone, period. And we did so under Frieder, too. But of course the program was a bit ethically challenged, too. The challenge going forward is to maintain a high level of achievement along with a high level of recruiting ethics. But don’t pretend that’s not a huge factor.
I'm with ya on most of it... But A2 doesn't have a fun atmosphere? It's one of the best college towns in the country
Depending on what demographic you’re referring to…A2 might have a fun atmosphere. As a michigan alum I must say that A2 isn’t necessarily a fun atmosphere to inner city kids, in fact, I’d say it’s the complete opposite.
Well, if you don't want to mention the elephant in the room that's fine, but we're not competing on equal footing with some of these schools (and I'd definitely throw Louisville and UCLA into that mix). As far as the "complete lack of talent" in the state of Michigan, I don't agree. Derrick Walton. Jaylen Johnson. Eric Davis. Cassius Winston. Miles Bridges. Brian Bowen. Josh Jackson. Possibly Xavier Tillman from the 2017 class. The issue is that some if not many of these kids are not recruitable.During the time that we were willing to do what it takes to get all the very top recruits, we did. The Fab Five. The Fresh Five. A three man class of all McDonalds All Americans (Traylor, Bullock, White). From 1991-1995, we recruited with anyone, period. And we did so under Frieder, too. But of course the program was a bit ethically challenged, too. The challenge going forward is to maintain a high level of achievement along with a high level of recruiting ethics. But don’t pretend that’s not a huge factor.
Good point, I guess I meant the state is void of talent relatively speaking when compared to the 80s and 90s when the state had an abundance of high major talent each and every year. Nowadays michigan might produce 3-4 high major kids per class. Kind of sad that michigans failure to adapt to a service based economy has impacted local collegiate sports to this extent. That’s an entirely different dialogue though…
MattD, I’m looking forward to the day when you actually acknowledge that we can’t recruit certain kids because they are looking for or willing to accept illegal benefits we won’t offer, as opposed to blaming the coaching staff for our inability to land a squad full of five star players. Are you ever going to comment on that issue, or will you just pretend it doesn’t exist? (Not trying to be sarcastic, I’d really like to know).
MattD, I'm looking forward to the day when you actually acknowledge that we can't recruit certain kids because they are looking for or willing to accept illegal benefits we won't offer, as opposed to blaming the coaching staff for our inability to land a squad full of five star players. Are you ever going to comment on that issue, or will you just pretend it doesn't exist? (Not trying to be sarcastic, I'd really like to know).
LA - I never placed “blame” on anyone. I simply said that we haven’t been hitting home runs in recruiting but that we’re able to compensate through development and a commitment to the long ball.
Regarding your contention, I simply refuse to speculate on something that serious without factual knowledge. If you’d like to, have at it, but I prefer not too. Im sure it does exist, but to what extent and at what respective institutions, I know not. So I simply refrain from entertaining that discourse.
That being said, is it not possible that these recruits simply don’t like what UM has to offer, or hold UM lower on the hierarchy in relation to other schools?
I don’t think anything illegal is happening here and I don’t even think Ali going elsewhere would be surprising. The Jalen Coleman and Notre Dame trending is what is baffling imo.
Solid LA. Without inferring anything more than what is already known about recruiting indisgressions of the past ( and I mean the past ) the days of the Tarpleys, Wades, Rellfords, Grants, Taylors, Traylors, Rumeals, Higgins, THE FIVERS, Crawfords, … are long gone. Where we were once universally connected to every top 10 instate kid, and a lengthy list of highly ranked national recruits almost obligatorily, that is not the juju now. We got spoiled over the years of being on practically every high ranked kids top 5 list, and let’s face it, it was fun. This coach is NOT going to compromise on principle or needless aggrandizement to court favor. I think he relishes getting lesser ranked recruits, and building a TEAM. Even though it’s great to be connected to a laundry list of national recruits for fan base excitement, it will never go back to what it was years ago. JB will not compromise integrity for talent, book it. He’ll look for talent that wants to be a good teammate, has a limited ego, and wants to be developed.
MattD, I think you should pay closer attention to what those who cover recruiting for a living say about it. As far as “factual knowledge,” do a Google search on Sam Gilbert, and then do a search on Sean Higgins’ recruitment, and tell me what you find. I’ll cut to the chase - you’ll find many documented instances of UCLA cheating. I’m not saying they are with Ali, I have no idea. But it sure wouldn’t surprise me. As far as Pitino and Louisville, that’s also far from a clean program. And look at all this academic fraud stuff going on with UNC - if we are recruiting a kid that isn’t crazy about going to class, he’s going to pick UNC over us, guaranteed. (Or at least he would have in the past few years - maybe they’ll buckle down now with all the attention).
As long as we choose to remain ethical in recruiting, we will lose many recruiting battles to schools like Kansas, Kentucky, UNC, UCLA, OSU, Louisville. Then there are countless other programs like Baylor and Memphis, that are also very shady. I have no problem speculating, because it’s really not that hard to see, if you are honestly looking. Duke is one program that may be cleaner than some of their contemporaries, and still thrives, mostly due to Coach K’s success, reputation, and affiliation with USA basketball.
This is why I don’t get caught up in who we aren’t recruiting in the top 50. I think we are much better off getting talented under the radar guys that are late bloomers. If we do get involved with a kid that is rated as elite, I trust the coaches have done their homework on the kid and their family and will bow out if anything gets shady.
I loved the Frieder and Fisher teams but I have no desire to go back to those days. Give me more of what we’ve had these past 6-7 years.
MattD, I think you should pay closer attention to what those who cover recruiting for a living say about it. As far as "factual knowledge," do a Google search on Sam Gilbert, and then do a search on Sean Higgins' recruitment, and tell me what you find. I'll cut to the chase - you'll find many documented instances of UCLA cheating. I'm not saying they are with Ali, I have no idea. But it sure wouldn't surprise me. As far as Pitino and Louisville, that's also far from a clean program. And look at all this academic fraud stuff going on with UNC - if we are recruiting a kid that isn't crazy about going to class, he's going to pick UNC over us, guaranteed. (Or at least he would have in the past few years - maybe they'll buckle down now with all the attention).
Building off this, if anyone enjoys reading hoops-related books, I highly recommend Seth Davis’ “Wooden”. Very enlightening read and lots of details on Sam Gilbert’s role in the UCLA dynasty. I couldn’t help but think of The similarities between Gilbert and Ed Martin and similarities between Wooden and Fisher as I read the book.
As far as "factual knowledge," do a Google search on Sam Gilbert, and then do a search on Sean Higgins' recruitment, and tell me what you find. I'll cut to the chase - you'll find many documented instances of UCLA cheating.
To be fair, this matters as much to the Ali recruitment as Ed Martin does. In other words, just because they’ve cheated in the past, doesn’t mean they’re doing it now.
UM, UL and UCLA are all Adidas and he prefers UCLA and UL it seems. I don’t think anything is funky other than going to Adidas only schools.
As far as "factual knowledge," do a Google search on Sam Gilbert, and then do a search on Sean Higgins' recruitment, and tell me what you find. I'll cut to the chase - you'll find many documented instances of UCLA cheating.To be fair, this matters as much to the Ali recruitment as Ed Martin does. In other words, just because they’ve cheated in the past, doesn’t mean they’re doing it now.
Perhaps Alford deserves a little benefit of the doubt, but it’s hard to make that leap knowing the history there.
Sam Gilbert was running things during Wooden through Walt Hazzard, Jim Harrick is one of the worst cheaters in the history of the sport, Lavin and Howland were no choir boys. The dotted line is a lot easier to construct at UCLA.
Not specifically saying this is what is happening with Prince Ali, but speaking more generally to MattD’s concerns over losing elite recruits to blue bloods and the role cheating plays in some of those recruitments.
As far as "factual knowledge," do a Google search on Sam Gilbert, and then do a search on Sean Higgins' recruitment, and tell me what you find. I'll cut to the chase - you'll find many documented instances of UCLA cheating.To be fair, this matters as much to the Ali recruitment as Ed Martin does. In other words, just because they’ve cheated in the past, doesn’t mean they’re doing it now.
Perhaps Alford deserves a little benefit of the doubt, but it’s hard to make that leap knowing the history there.
Alford is a scumbag of the highest order and his transgressions go far beyond just cheating at basketball.
The Jalen Coleman and Notre Dame trending is what is baffling imo.
Yeah, I don’t get what Notre Dame has over us in basketball right now?
- Beilein is a way better coach than Brey…it’s not even close
- Team ceiling at Michigan is high, Notre Dame is just happy to make the NCAA tourney
- Playing Time opportunities at both
- Notre Dame is 2.5 hrs from Indy, Ann Arbor is 4 hrs…not a huge difference
- Ann Arbor is much much better than South Bend
- Academic opportunities at both are very good
- Basketball atmosphere at UM is way better than Notre Dame
- Latest NBA development hands down goes to Beilein