He SHOULD test the waters, yeah. It seems at this point it would be ridiculous for him to stay 4 years. I’m just hoping to get a second year.
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Not exactly sure where to post mocks but this is from today and has Franz at 13 to Denver.
*Thanks Dylan, don’t know how I missed this thread lol
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Franz late first, Isaiah late second.
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I’m sure this has been answered before so my apologies in advance: Which guys/gals are generally considered the best NBA Draft prognosticators and is there a resource that tracks their accuracy?
I would just look at everything during the season as speculation. Even if there were people who track how accurate mock drafts are, it would be based on the mock drafts they put out the week of the draft.
Sam Vecenie goes pretty in depth. The ESPN guys Givony/Schmitz do a lot of leg work. I’d worry more about what people are saying to try to glean info about the thought process than worrying about the specifics of where guys are ranked.
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Here is an early 2021 nba mock draft has Franz Wagner going 13th to the Grizzlies.
Interesting mock. Never seen Ayayi in the first, and including Keyontae Johnson right now feels weird. Don’t know much about Woo other than I think seeing him on NBA Draft twitter
Going to use all of these Todd-less mock drafts to bring up an unpopular point that I had before.
Isaiah Todd would have been a negative impact player at Michigan. Loads of potential but his high school tape showed that he was barely an impact player in HS.
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I strongly disagree with the “Barely an impact player in HS” notion. But I definitely agree with the bigger point you make.
Isaiah Todd always felt to me like one of those players who doesn’t quite play “winning” basketball. Todd would be able to score a lot of points, have some highlight plays, and probably grab a lot of rebounds and block some shots with his length. But he also would require a lot of FG attempts in order for him to “get his”. He isn’t very efficient, and would probably be shooting pretty low percentages. He also didn’t appear to be consistently locked in on defense according to scouts.
Compare Todd to a guy like Chaundee Brown. Isaiah Todd is obviously much more talented than Chaundee, and has a much higher ceiling. But Chaundee plays winning basketball. Chaundee doesn’t take too many shots but he’s pretty darn efficient with the attempts he does take. He also goes extremely hard on defense and provides the team with quite literally an enthusiasm unknown to mankind. Chaundee doesn’t demand anything either. He gives and doesn’t really take.
I think at this point we all know who we would rather have between the two. Yet when Todd decided to de-commit I thought the sky was falling.
When Christopher de-committed, I was hoping that Todd would as well. My thought process was that the only way Todd could become an impact player is if there was someone else to carry the load. I think without Christopher, Todd would have tried to do too much. I mean he’s a guy who told Overtime (the brand) with a straight face that he could beat Kevin Durant one-on-one. Love the confidence but I don’t think it would have done Michigan well.
“Barely an impact player in HS” is definitely taking it very far. But from watching his full games with Word of God, I just found it really frustrating cheering for him and finding excuses for myself to like him as a player. It did not look like they missed a beat when he wasn’t on the floor. That was largely because when he was on the floor, he was jacking up fadeaway midrange shots, off-balanced floaters and turning the ball over most of the time. The only time he was effective in the half court is when he was utilized as a dunker in the paint (I say dunker specifically because he wasn’t a good finisher either) or a spot-up outside shooter, while letting his un-recruited teammates create. At a certain point, I just accepted that a player who couldn’t even control the play at an average high school team was likely not going to do that at a higher level, and it makes it worse that it seems like he thinks he can.
I know I’m really laying it out on Todd, but I haven’t paid attention to any top prospect as much as I have with him, and so I really do hope he reaches his ceiling and makes it to the NBA.
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Given that the G League Ignite team hasn’t played a single official game I think the cart is getting put light years ahead of the horse here about Todd’s future and draft status.
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Probably true, but I watched Todd’s tape and thought to myself “if that kid is willing to stick it out in college for at least two years he is going to be great and maybe an early pick”. I never saw a lottery pick. But I did see a guy that Juwan could have really developed if he was willing to learn and be patient.
Finally…I am very curious what happens with this G League route. What Todd needs is good coaching and playing time with good players around him. Will he get both? Will he improve his draft stock? What happens to him next year if he isn’t drafted? Will the NBA keep throwing large contracts at these kids after the pandemic and if half of them don’t end up being high picks? Will this be awesome and more players will flock toward it?
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Todd was always more theoretical than actual. He’d been dropping in rankings since he was a freshman when he was considered a top 3 guy. Just not really great at anything, and add a below average motor and not a great BB IQ and you get a guy that the NBA is not really interested in and that would have been a poor college player as a freshman. Having said that, I could see a world where he was solid for us, but of course it’d be him entirely changing the way he plays basketball. I don’t know how realistic that would be but I’m not gonna say it’s impossible
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I just think that citing a lack of current evidence and comparing it to a hypothetical to confirm an assumption maybe isn’t the soundest path of thought. 
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How much of Todd’s film did you watch? How much of that was full games? It’s hard to believe that it’s been much if you have issue with anything that these people have said.
Setting aside what Todd showed on film and his attitude or whatever else … absolutely no one thinks he’s going in the first round. And it’s not that they’re undervaluing the G-League Ignite players because lots of people have Daishen Nix going in the lottery, and he’s not even good. What that tells me is that not only do the draft analysts not see anything in Todd, but also their contacts (ie NBA scouts and other front office staff) haven’t been dropping any hints to check up on him.
Do you feel like maybe your assessments are a bit harsh?
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Lol fair call out there. He’s an exciting player, I just feel like he’s the typical draft board darling that NBA teams aren’t going to see much value in.
THREE Jalens in the top EIGHT and none from Michigan smh
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I was just bringing up what I felt about him in high school and how it likely wouldn’t have translated here/NBA. That’s really all. I don’t have “current evidence” but I feel like what he showed less than a year ago is still relevant in projecting what he could be/could have been here. You’re right in that before he plays a game, there’s no way of really projecting if anything changes. But I remember people projecting him as a one and done first rounder, and so his lack of presence on most draft lists may indicate what NBA scouts felt about him in high school as well.
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