This discussion was created from comments split from: One name to remember: Seth Dugan.
IMO 1 of Doyle and Wilson should redshirt after Italy and first couple of games and 1 of Teske/Dugan/Davis should be taken and redshirted.I am sure that was the plan had Horford or McGary stayed.
But given the situation now, unless Max Beilfeldt gives us a pleasant surprise, we almost certainly need both Ricky and DJ to contribute on the floor.
JB isn’t playing more than 8 maybe 9 guys so I don’t buy that. Italy and a few non-conference games will show who is and isn’t ready and a 7 man class without RS is a big mistake.
JB isn't playing more than 8 maybe 9 guys so I don't buy that. Italy and a few non-conference games will show who is and isn't ready and a 7 man class without RS is a big mistake.
I see your point and not I do not agree with you on the importance of class balance. But
1, JB prioritizes winning the next season over managing the class balance.
2, It takes more than a few games to iron out a short stable rotation, especially when a lot of your players are freshman who are still adjusting and learning.
3, extending from my previous point, unless Max plays major minutes, I don’t see an obvious alternative to the front court rotation without playing both DJ and Doyle. There may be some solutions, such as an Irvin/Chatman/Dawkins rotation at 3/4, but it also takes time to experiment it out.
My mistake for lack of clarity, I was referring to the decline in interior D in relation to JMo's defense from last year.
Gotcha. This I agree with. I’m hoping for some better D from the 1-3 positions next year, and we may have some more shotblocking at the 4 and 5 positions, but we will certainly miss JMo’s interior D and suffer a decline there. I do hope that Donnal’s redshirt year will render him a little more prepared than if he were a true freshman.
If JB is playing more than 9 players then we aren’t a tournament team. I’d take a bet of me being banned on that assertion, too.
If JB is playing more than 9 players then we aren't a tournament team. I'd take a bet of me being banned on that assertion, too.This has nothing to do redshirting Wilson/Doyle. Rotations are not set until late in the season. You have to play them out.
If Rotations are not set until late in the season.
I disagree… most good coaches know their rotation by the midway point of non-conference. JB isn’t playing more than 9 guys 10 mpg or more. Guys are going to sit.
I will use this to demonstrate Guestavo’s point, which I agree with to a certain extent. In football, the saying is this, “if you have more than 1 QB, you have no QB”
I disagree... most good coaches know their rotation by the midway point of non-conference. JB isn't playing more than 9 guys 10 mpg or more. Guys are going to sit.
Midway through nonconference is still too late to redshirt unless there’s a medical reason, I believe.
Also, I agree that JB won’t be playing more than 9 guys 10 mpg. But getting guys some minutes can have advantages because you never know when they’ll need to step up. Bielfeldt only played more than 10 minutes twice all last year, but one was a key nonconference game against Stanford and the other was in the B1G tourney final. And he played 4 mins against KY.
Finally, the question again is who would RS. MAAR is the 10th guy, do you RS him given his age? Probably not. So the only guys who appear real options are Doyle or Wilson. I just don’t think either of those guys will be outside the top 8 or 9 and RS. The only way it would happen is if Doyle is clearly behind Donnal and Wilson at the 5 or Wilson is clearly behind Chatman and Dawkins at the 4 from the get go. And i doubt that happens. Remember, Doyle is the biggest guy on the team, and we’re not overflowing with size next year, as opposed to last year when we started out with McGary, Morgan, Horford, and Bielfeldlt, besides Donnal.
Then we aren’t a tournament team and the roster has been mishandled.
If JB is playing more than 9 players then we aren't a tournament team. I'd take a bet of me being banned on that assertion, too.
I think it’s definitely possible there is an 8-man rotation that includes both Doyle and Wilson: Walton-Albrecht-LeVert-Irvin-Chatman-Wilson-Donnal-Doyle. However, I’d guess Dawkins or Abdur-Rahkman would get some non-end-of-game-blowout minutes as well.
And I don’t think you necessarily need to redshirt the other one to achieve class balance on the roster - even when it bumps up to 8 players with Duncan Robinson redshirting. Odds are, it will work its way out naturally through transfer, medical redshirt, leaving early for pros, etc. And if it doesn’t, then at least Ben can look forward to a monster 8-man, all 5-stars, 2018 recruiting class.
Then we aren't a tournament team and the roster has been mishandled.
What does “then” refer to?
Then we aren't a tournament team and the roster has been mishandled.What does “then” refer to?
If no one is redshirting or if Dawkins and MAAR are both RS
Here’s how I see it:
Players for sure to get rotation minutes:
Walton
Levert
Irvin
Chatman
Donnal
Spike
Players that are likely to get minutes:
Doyle (need based on only having 1 other C with reasonable size)
Max - based off experience alone
Dawkins - most likely to be backup at the 3/4 because of athleticism/size combination, defense and ability to shoot from deep
Players battling for minutes:
Wilson - needs to add strength to play 4 and probably not quick enough to defend 3
MAAR - seems most likely to backup Levert, but I can see Dawkins cutting into some of those minutes because Irvin can slide to the 2 and Dawkins can slide to the 3 because of versatility.
I’d be stunned if we are not a tourney team.
I see the starters being: Walton, Levert, Irvin, Chatman, Donnal.
Primary backups will be Spike, Dawkins (at the 3, IMO, with Irvin sliding to the 2), Wilson, and Doyle. So, I do see a 9 man rotation. Maybe MAAR gets run at the two, and Dawkins plays 3/4, allowing Wilson to redshirt if he’s not strong enough yet to contribute.
We used 8 guys last year: Walton, Spike, Nik, Levert, Glenn, Irvin, Morgan and Horford. But we were thin up front and I don’t think JB would have ideally used Irvin at the four at all if we had bigger bodies. If Mitch was healthy, it would have been a 9 man rotation IMO.
JB used an 8 man last year, year before that. year before that…
Horford would not have been in the rotation with a healthy McGary.
And Max won’t be apart of the rotation and by rotation, I mean 10mpg +
Players that are likely to get minutes:If Max is better than both Wilson and Abdur-Rahkman, then we've got issues.Doyle (need based on only having 1 other C with reasonable size)
Max - based off experience alone
Dawkins - most likely to be backup at the 3/4 because of athleticism/size combination, defense and ability to shoot from deepPlayers battling for minutes:
Wilson - needs to add strength to play 4 and probably not quick enough to defend 3
MAAR - seems most likely to backup Levert, but I can see Dawkins cutting into some of those minutes because Irvin can slide to the 2 and Dawkins can slide to the 3 because of versatility.
For those thinking Dawkins will redshirt: reports are that he has been VERY impressive in practice thus far. DJ actually is the one who needs to step it up.
practice? ehhhhhhh…Let me know when the reports come out of Italy.
Hey guys 
At least they are playing a game in 20 days or so. Will give us plenty to discuss.