Team Review After 1/4 Season

I don’t think either of us are looking at cause and effect. Michigan statistically is a pretty darn good defensive rebounding team. Why? Because Ricky Doyle, Max, and Donnal are future NBA stars, of course…just kidding. The reason is the way people play against us. Teams don’t attack the offense glass as much against Michigan in an effort to stop our transition attack. In my opinion, this works more in our favor than against us. We aren’t able to push as much as we would like, but at the same time, we can rebound quite well with our 1 big man lineups.

Also, I think you are way off on the idea that guards rebounding will push tempo. The guard grabbing the rebound under the hoop puts you way behind the defense getting back. If guards on the opposition rotate back against Michigan (which has been obvious by stats every game but Oregon) then a guard grabbing a board is probably 40 feet behind the opposition’s guards…common sense.

Not necessarily true because waiting for the big to gather the board and the subsequent outlet pass, or the guard coming back to the ball can take the same amount of clock, if not more, than the guard rebounding the ball. In functional terms, this means the defense has a chance to get back on D in either scenario…

Also disagree that we are a good defensive rebounding team, I’d say average. We are #98 in defensive rebounding % nationally, and #5 in B10. I wouldn’t characterize that as good, but average/slightly above average.

You make a case there for sure, but I think that is way less likely than the scenarios I presented.

In any sense, Syracuse is a very bad case study to show if we want to get out in transition, but a good one to highlight my point. Would we have liked to? YES! Anyone knows that against Syracuse. Could we? Obviously not as we needed all hands on deck on the glass.

I do think every game presents different challenges and scenarios and agree that Michigan should push as much as possible when possible.

I generally agree with the original post. My own highlights touching on some of the topics to now.

Walton didn’t look much like he was near full-go last night. I’d be OK with sitting him for the EMU game to get him more rest so he can be fully ready for the next big test. I do think both he and Spike made concerted efforts to get into the zone and kickout which helped us.

On Spike, it’s really nice to see what he’s able to do with more minutes and opportunities. Reverting to more of the “two guard” lineup from earlier in Beilein’s career seems like a viable look for this team in certain situations. Not all though, that would give up some defense.

Kam is still playing catch up, but he’s definitely getting closer. By the end of B1G play if he’s still healthy I think he will be a real contributor as far as his role is concerned. That is, able to get some rebounds, hit corner threes more reliably (fingers crossed) and be somewhat closer on defensive closeouts.

Donnal needs some kind of fire lit under him. I don’t know how to do it, but that seems to have been a theme ever since he was in AAU based on some old interviews with coach Dan Dakich. I personally was higher on Donnal’s potential as a UM player when he came in, but he is not delivering so far. Hopefully he learns a lot getting his first real PT this year.

Caris seems to really feel the college game pretty well right now. I think I can agree he may not be a lottery pick, but that may be my selfishness talking. He clearly can go off for video-game type shots, which is nice to have.

Doyle has surpassed my expectations. Even if he’s not able to be a huge help on D, having him as a threat on the inside to dish and finish is critical. Neither of the other two options are there at this point.

The best thing for Wilson is for him to take a medical redshirt and focus on building his body. I think he will be a good player for Michigan before he leaves (not ruling out NBA for that eventually), but he just needs some time/seasoning.

I just don’t know that we’re using Donnal the right way right now. He looks his worst when he’s trying to finish down low. Right now I don’t think he’s more than a spot up shooter, pick n pop guy, etc. Definitely a finesse guy that gets abused by the rim.

The thing is, he actually has more athleticism than Doyle…he just fails to use it. Toughness is very hard to teach…Ricky has it, Mark doesn’t…really that simplistic in my opinion.

Mark has confidence issues, it’s that simple. Theoretically, how much bigger can Mark get in the weight room? Seems like he has a lot of room for improvement body-wise, yet he has been on the team just as long as Irvin and Walton.

Matt, disagree that we lack creators and have good shooting thus far. Shooting actually has me worried a bit. Irvin is a dynamite all-around player now, but that seems to have cost him in terms of shooting, in that he can’t be dialed in on the basket all the time. Shooting 40% from the field is not going to get it done for this team, especially not on the road. LeVert, Walton and Chatman are all adequate shooters, but certainly not great, certainly not guys you can count on to hit a jumpshot (LeVert’s “retractable claw” shooting motion will never make me feel comfortable with him shooting).

I actually see why the staff wanted Duncan Robinson for next year: Walton, Irvin, Chatman and maybe MAAR will all create, but Spike is the only guy on the team who you watch pull up to shoot and consistently think “cash”. I hope Irvin finds his shot, because we’re going to need better efficiency from him than 18 points on 17 shots. Same with Walton and LeVert.

Although with Irvin’s newfound strength and quickness, I’d say it’s not out of the question that he could sneak into the first round this year.

I agree with the assessment of Donnal vs Doyle. Donnal needs to use his strength, not shy away from contact and he needs to play lower to the ground (he stands way to straight up and down to effectively use his strength).

It seems like Doyle is not going for a lot of defensive rebounds. He is focused on boxing out, getting low and taking his man out of the equation so Levert, Walton, Irvin and Chatman can get rebounds and push the ball without an outlet pass. I like this strategy although it is against conventional wisdom I think it works very when a team has fast guards like Walton and Levert.

My guess is that Doyle will be a monster in coming years. In my mind, Doyle, obviously is not our best player at this point but he is the one that we can least afford to lose to injury. Am I the only one that is beginning to see Doyle as the player that is most essential to our success this year?

Couple of added thoughts to the posts here:

On Spike, one thing that is really striking is his A:TO ratio. 9:0 last night against that zone, which typically eats short guards for breakfast, and 34:4 on the season. With his athletic limitations, that’s just off the charts, and a huge part of what makes him so valuable. I also agree that his confidence rubs off on the team.

On Wilson, I think the staff can intend to redshirt him, but pull it later in the year either in case of emergency or if he is able to come on in practice to the point where he’d contribute on the floor. That’s effectively how it went for Caris (though Caris’ would have been a traditional shirt whereas Wilson’s would have to be a medical). They got through part of the season fully intending on redshirting Caris, but couldn’t keep him off the floor. Maybe once Wilson is fully healthy, he can come up the curve fast enough to contribute. It’s a nice “option” to have.

Someone mentioned how good Doyles hands are and it does appear that he is very good at catching the difficult passes–much better than Horford and Morgan, imo.

Matt, disagree that we lack creators and have good shooting thus far. Shooting actually has me worried a bit. Irvin is a dynamite all-around player now, but that seems to have cost him in terms of shooting, in that he can't be dialed in on the basket all the time. Shooting 40% from the field is not going to get it done for this team, especially not on the road. LeVert, Walton and Chatman are all adequate shooters, but certainly not great, certainly not guys you can count on to hit a jumpshot (LeVert's "retractable claw" shooting motion will never make me feel comfortable with him shooting).

I actually see why the staff wanted Duncan Robinson for next year: Walton, Irvin, Chatman and maybe MAAR will all create, but Spike is the only guy on the team who you watch pull up to shoot and consistently think “cash”. I hope Irvin finds his shot, because we’re going to need better efficiency from him than 18 points on 17 shots. Same with Walton and LeVert.

Although with Irvin’s newfound strength and quickness, I’d say it’s not out of the question that he could sneak into the first round this year.

This is a bit extreme, no? I actually have a bet with Hail that Irvin will shoot sub 40% from 3 for the year, so I don’t think he’s that good of a shooter, but to say you’re worried when the man is shooting 43% from range is ridiculous. Walton is shooting 39% from 3 and Caris 44%…I mean serously, do you want all to be 50%+ shooters from 3?

Irvin a “dynamite all around player”? We must be watching two entirely different players…we’re talking about a guy that literally trips over himself when attempting to create off the dribble and hasn’t used PnR once this year to effectively create for others.

Chatman an “adequate” shooter but Irvin is not?..again we must be watching 2 different players

I would count on Irvin, Walton and Levert to hit catch and shoot 3s all day, every day.

We have exactly 2 creators, Spike (the best) and Caris. How can you not be worried about creators for next year if Caris leaves and Spike scheduled to leave the year after?

That weaving drive and lay-in that Irvin had last night was certainly eye-opening. If that’s truly in his arsenal…look out.

From what I have witnessed all of our players have improved including Sean lonergan and Max Biefeldt and that is something to be very happy about. The player who has showed the most drastic improvement is Irvin in my opinion.

Matt, disagree that we lack creators and have good shooting thus far. Shooting actually has me worried a bit. Irvin is a dynamite all-around player now, but that seems to have cost him in terms of shooting, in that he can't be dialed in on the basket all the time. Shooting 40% from the field is not going to get it done for this team, especially not on the road. LeVert, Walton and Chatman are all adequate shooters, but certainly not great, certainly not guys you can count on to hit a jumpshot (LeVert's "retractable claw" shooting motion will never make me feel comfortable with him shooting).

I actually see why the staff wanted Duncan Robinson for next year: Walton, Irvin, Chatman and maybe MAAR will all create, but Spike is the only guy on the team who you watch pull up to shoot and consistently think “cash”. I hope Irvin finds his shot, because we’re going to need better efficiency from him than 18 points on 17 shots. Same with Walton and LeVert.

Although with Irvin’s newfound strength and quickness, I’d say it’s not out of the question that he could sneak into the first round this year.

This is a bit extreme, no? I actually have a bet with Hail that Irvin will shoot sub 40% from 3 for the year, so I don’t think he’s that good of a shooter, but to say you’re worried when the man is shooting 43% from range is ridiculous. Walton is shooting 39% from 3 and Caris 44%…I mean serously, do you want all to be 50%+ shooters from 3?

Irvin a “dynamite all around player”? We must be watching two entirely different players…we’re talking about a guy that literally trips over himself when attempting to create off the dribble and hasn’t used PnR once this year to effectively create for others.

Chatman an “adequate” shooter but Irvin is not?..again we must be watching 2 different players

I would count on Irvin, Walton and Levert to hit catch and shoot 3s all day, every day.

We have exactly 2 creators, Spike (the best) and Caris. How can you not be worried about creators for next year if Caris leaves and Spike scheduled to leave the year after?

Irvin: 43% against mostly creampuffs. He’s 33% from 3 vs Oregon, Nova and Syracuse. That’s not going to cut it.

Walton: 39% against mostly creampuffs. He’s 25% from 3 vs Oregon, Nova and Syracuse. That’s not going to cut it.

LeVert: 44% against mostly creampuffs. He’s 31% from 3 vs Oregon, Nova and Syracuse. That’s not going to cut it.

Chatman is an adequate shooter in that he has the ability to hit jumpshots once he calms down…pretty much sums up his entire game right now.

With Irvin, yes, we must be watching two different players because I’ve seen a guy get to the basket and into the paint with regularity these first 7 games. If you’re telling me Walton and Irvin aren’t creators and that Chatman hasn’t flashed that ability to you…idk what to say other than I disagree.

I’m certainly saying Walton isn’t a creator…he’s purely catch and shoot in the half court…his only internally created offense comes from transition.

In no way, shape, or form can you claim that Levert, Walton, and Irvin are not adequate while Chatman is…simply doesn’t make sense considering Kam is 16.6% from 3 against those same 3 opponents. How one guy is adequate while shooting a considerably lower percentage than the 3 aforementioned is beyond me.

Irvin - he can get to the basket off poor closeouts with 1-2 dribbles, but to ask him to create offense at the top of the key and change direction, is to ask for trouble and I think most would readily acknowledge that. He simply can’t handle the ball if we’re being honest.

Irvin seems to be on his way to be a more complete player. I like what I see and I think he is much better at creating for himself but he really has not shown any signs of creating for anyone else (which in my opinion is a possible next step in his development). Is that what we mean by creator here? Or do you mean he is not good at creating for himself?

I mean both…to be adequate in that regard I think a player needs to have the ability to take a defender off the dribble without help from a poor closeout. Irvin simply can’t do that at this point with regularity, or with any type of consistency.

I'm certainly saying Walton isn't a creator.........he's purely catch and shoot in the half court.........his only internally created offense comes from transition.

In no way, shape, or form can you claim that Levert, Walton, and Irvin are not adequate while Chatman is…simply doesn’t make sense considering Kam is 16.6% from 3 against those same 3 opponents. How one guy is adequate while shooting a considerably lower percentage than the 3 aforementioned is beyond me.

Irvin - he can get to the basket off poor closeouts with 1-2 dribbles, but to ask him to create offense at the top of the key and change direction, is to ask for trouble and I think most would readily acknowledge that. He simply can’t handle the ball if we’re being honest.

Ok, Chatman has the ability to be adequate. I know how to shoot a basketball, I watch Chatman shoot and I can tell he has the ability to be an adequate shooter. I expect Irvin to be there now. I expect Chatman to be there once he settles down.

You are watching a different Walton than I am. He gets into the paint, he gets to the rim. For Christ’s sake, watch Spike’s game-winner again and tell me who split two defenders on a jumpstop into the middle of the zone to create that open look. You have to be kidding me that Walton isn’t a creator. It’s not debatable

Walton isn’t even a good catch-and-shoot player. He’s adequate at it, but that’s way down the list of his abilities. It’s certainly not a strength of his.