Of course it’s fine, provided we upgrade the talent in light of Caris departing
Of course it's fine, provided we upgrade the talent in light of Caris departing
Meanwhile, let’s enjoy having Caris.
Hardaway was not extremely talented in HS, he became a good player in college. Burke was extremely underrated.......but let's not forget that Benji Burke had to actually call JB and give him an ultimatum concerning a scholarship (JB wanted to grey shirt Trey), so it's not like JB's eye for talent was at work, his hand was forced. GR3 was en elite athlete, so give JB credit on that one. Stauskas was certainly an upper-tier, multifaceted player, so again, credit to JB.Bottom line for me, we need instant impact players to be elite in today’s college basketball world, projects simply won’t get it done. JB is a damn good coach in terms of offensive playcalling and execution, but I think his recruiting lacks behind his coaching, and that is of concern to me.
Need a blue chipper every year. Still can have projects like DJ Wilson mixed in, but you need a blue chipper every year to be successful, and possibly more if those guys are gone after 2 years. I think you can consider Kam a blue chipper, but none in 2015, so desperately need 1 in 2016, and would be better to have 2. Battle and Thornton would be huge for this program, not to mention a diamond in the rough in 15.
We’ll see on the talent this year. MattD, if this board had existed at this time last year, I’ll bet we would have found you making all the same arguments after our loss to Charlotte. You sometimes jump to conclusions quickly based on very little data.
Another thought.
Last year, the big three were Nik, Glenn and Caris, with Walton, Morgan and Irvin being our next top three.
This year, I think Irvin will be a step up over Robinson. He’s a much better shooter and scorer. Can Caris replace Nik’s production? On offense, maybe not quite. But his assists, rebounding and defense might make that a real close comparison. Can Walton this year match Caris of last year? Tall order but thus far he’s on pace.
The key to me will be getting Chatman to give us the numbers Walton did last year, our three headed center to match Morgan and Horford’s output, and someone else (Dawkins?) to give us outside shooting off the bench.
Another thought.Last year, the big three were Nik, Glenn and Caris, with Walton, Morgan and Irvin being our next top three.
This year, I think Irvin will be a step up over Robinson. He’s a much better shooter and scorer. Can Caris replace Nik’s production? On offense, maybe not quite. But his assists, rebounding and defense might make that a real close comparison. Can Walton this year match Caris of last year? Tall order but thus far he’s on pace.
The key to me will be getting Chatman to give us the numbers Walton did last year, our three headed center to match Morgan and Horford’s output, and someone else (Dawkins?) to give us outside shooting off the bench.
That’s how I see it, too. That team won the Big Ten by 3 games and made the Elite 8. Even if this years team is worse, it can still be a very solid season.
I guess my point is, the lineup doesn't really matter, we simply don't have the talent to compete at the same level of the previous 2 years regardless of growth
Will see Matt, way to early to make this type of statement. I think your underrating Michigan’s talent and overrating the talent level of the rest of college basketball. Once again outside of Kentucky there is no one that really jumps out to me with the talent level that says “wow, they have more talent then Michigan and it’s going to be an uphill battle” even this Kentucky team I don’t believe is as talented as the team that won the national title. There is no Anthony Davis, John Wall, DeMarcus Cousins, Brandon Knight, Julius Randle, etc on this Kentucky team or dominant player that can take over a game/change a game that is their only drawback. I think this years NCAA tournament is going to be similar to last years NCAA tournament where you could have a high seed like a UCONN go far because they have a dominant backcourt and a player who can take over a game and carry a team. 2 Teams that fit that bill this year(Michigan) dominant backcourt and a player in the LeVert who can take over a game, UNC(Marcus paige) capable of taking over a game and putting his team on his back. Your not going to beat Kentucky in the paint they are too talented, your going to have to beat them from the perimeter and with the loss of James Young they lost their best perimeter scorer from last year and their best perimeter defender. That would be the one advantage Michigan would have going against them this year as opposed to last year
I guess my point is, the lineup doesn't really matter, we simply don't have the talent to compete at the same level of the previous 2 years regardless of growthWill see Matt, way to early to make this type of statement. I think your underrating Michigan’s talent and overrating the talent level of the rest of college basketball. Once again outside of Kentucky there is no one that really jumps out to me with the talent level that says “wow, they have more talent then Michigan and it’s going to be an uphill battle” even this Kentucky team I don’t believe is as talented as the team that won the national title. There is no Anthony Davis, John Wall, DeMarcus Cousins, Brandon Knight, Julius Randle, etc on this Kentucky team or dominant player that can take over a game/change a game that is their only drawback. I think this years NCAA tournament is going to be similar to last years NCAA tournament where you could have a high seed like a UCONN go far because they have a dominant backcourt and a player who can take over a game and carry a team. 2 Teams that fit that bill this year(Michigan) dominant backcourt and a player in the LeVert who can take over a game, UNC(Marcus paige) capable of taking over a game and putting his team on his back. Your not going to beat Kentucky in the paint they are too talented, your going to have to beat them from the perimeter and with the loss of James Young they lost their best perimeter scorer from last year and their best perimeter defender. That would be the one advantage Michigan would have going against them this year as opposed to last year
Just within the conference, Wisconsin and Ohio State are significantly more talented than Michigan this year. Beating either one of them will be a major uphill battle.
Around the country, haven’t seen enough basketball to make a judgement on most teams, but Duke is way more talented than Michigan.
I would not call OSU “significantly more talented” than Michigan. Wisconsin? Sure. Getting Kaminsky back was a gift; it would be like Nik deciding to stay.
I guess my point is, the lineup doesn't really matter, we simply don't have the talent to compete at the same level of the previous 2 years regardless of growthWill see Matt, way to early to make this type of statement. I think your underrating Michigan’s talent and overrating the talent level of the rest of college basketball. Once again outside of Kentucky there is no one that really jumps out to me with the talent level that says “wow, they have more talent then Michigan and it’s going to be an uphill battle” even this Kentucky team I don’t believe is as talented as the team that won the national title. There is no Anthony Davis, John Wall, DeMarcus Cousins, Brandon Knight, Julius Randle, etc on this Kentucky team or dominant player that can take over a game/change a game that is their only drawback. I think this years NCAA tournament is going to be similar to last years NCAA tournament where you could have a high seed like a UCONN go far because they have a dominant backcourt and a player who can take over a game and carry a team. 2 Teams that fit that bill this year(Michigan) dominant backcourt and a player in the LeVert who can take over a game, UNC(Marcus paige) capable of taking over a game and putting his team on his back. Your not going to beat Kentucky in the paint they are too talented, your going to have to beat them from the perimeter and with the loss of James Young they lost their best perimeter scorer from last year and their best perimeter defender. That would be the one advantage Michigan would have going against them this year as opposed to last year
Just within the conference, Wisconsin and Ohio State are significantly more talented than Michigan this year. Beating either one of them will be a major uphill battle.
Around the country, haven’t seen enough basketball to make a judgement on most teams, but Duke is way more talented than Michigan.
I don’t agree, with any of this. I measure “significantly talented” on next level players(guys with an NBA future and who are going be first round picks), Wisconsin has 2… Kaminsky and Dekker with an outside shot of Nigel Hayes. Wisconsin is a very good team, but it isn’t a team that is going to significantly out talent Michigan.
OSU same thing… who are the next level players. Dangelo Russell and? Again this isn’t a vintage Thad Matta team. OSU is also playing alot of zone this year which is really odd to me as Matta has never been a big zone guy, I don’t know whether it’s because he is not confident in his team’s ability to defend 1 on 1 at this point in the season… but Michigan under Beilein is not a team you want to zone.
Duke again… who are the next level players that actually contribute(Don’t name me 5 stars who barely play). Okafor and Justice Winslow… who else? Would you take Quinn Cook or Tyus Jones over Derrick Walton? I wouldn’t. Would you take Matt jones or Rasheed Slauimon over Zak Irvin? I wouldn’t. Amile Jefferson over Kameron Chatman(I think Chatman is only going to get better as the season goes on) I wouldn’t take Jefferson over Chatman’s potential. Duke again very good team, just like Wisconsin not a team that is going to significantly out talent Michigan
Kentucky and Arizona are the only teams capable of out-talenting and outathlete Michigan, and they could do it to pretty much everybody if they play to their ceiling
Eh, I’m one of the more “glass half full” guys I know, but there are a handful of teams more talented than Michigan. I think Michigan is appropriately ranked between 15-25th. Duke and Wisconsin are quite clearly top 5 teams, IMO, and would both take 7 games out of 10 vs Michigan.
I guess my point is, the lineup doesn't really matter, we simply don't have the talent to compete at the same level of the previous 2 years regardless of growthWill see Matt, way to early to make this type of statement. I think your underrating Michigan’s talent and overrating the talent level of the rest of college basketball. Once again outside of Kentucky there is no one that really jumps out to me with the talent level that says “wow, they have more talent then Michigan and it’s going to be an uphill battle” even this Kentucky team I don’t believe is as talented as the team that won the national title. There is no Anthony Davis, John Wall, DeMarcus Cousins, Brandon Knight, Julius Randle, etc on this Kentucky team or dominant player that can take over a game/change a game that is their only drawback. I think this years NCAA tournament is going to be similar to last years NCAA tournament where you could have a high seed like a UCONN go far because they have a dominant backcourt and a player who can take over a game and carry a team. 2 Teams that fit that bill this year(Michigan) dominant backcourt and a player in the LeVert who can take over a game, UNC(Marcus paige) capable of taking over a game and putting his team on his back. Your not going to beat Kentucky in the paint they are too talented, your going to have to beat them from the perimeter and with the loss of James Young they lost their best perimeter scorer from last year and their best perimeter defender. That would be the one advantage Michigan would have going against them this year as opposed to last year
Just within the conference, Wisconsin and Ohio State are significantly more talented than Michigan this year. Beating either one of them will be a major uphill battle.
Around the country, haven’t seen enough basketball to make a judgement on most teams, but Duke is way more talented than Michigan.
Lol… This was sad last year, too. Michigan went 15-3 in conference to Ohio St.'s 10-8. Michigan made it to the Elite 8 while Ohio St. crapped their pants to a 11 seeded MAC team in their 1st game.
In talent, I’d give the edge to Duke, Kansas (although they looked dreadful against UK), UK, AZ, Wisconsin, probably UNC, possibly Louisville, but offhand I’m not sure who else.
OSU has a phenomenal blend of size, athleticism, and skill. Even if Amir Williams isn’t a good player, he will dominate Donnal/Doyle/Wilson on size and strength alone. Shannon Scott looked incredible vs Marquette (14 assists!), and DeAngelo Russell is a stud. Loving, Williams and Thompson are luxuries to have as role players, and if they get anything out of the other freshmen this year…wow. I don’t think they’re far behind Wisconsin at all. Matta can recruit like few can.
We’ll see. Russell is an elite talent, but only a true freshman. He certainly isn’t on par with Levert, for example. Scott is decent, but I’d rather have Derrick Walton. I don’t see Williams “dominating” our guys. How? A “dominating” offensive performance for him is like 10 points, and we’re not going to challenge him on defense, so how exactly will he dominate?
I see at least three future pros on our team - Irvin, Walton, and Levert. Levert is a top 2-3 player in the Big Ten this year. On their team, I see one future pro in Russell, and another in KBD who, like Chatman, is struggling right now as a true freshman. The rest of their team is athletic (Thompson, Scott), but not very skilled. Losing Ross was a huge blow for them.
Matta is a great recruiter. But I’d say the last squad he had that was capable of winning a national title was 2011-2012, with Sullinger still around. The past two teams, and this team, don’t have the horses, especially on offense.
Agree with both of the comments. I think Beilein agrees as well based on PT in the 2nd half. I think Kam will get there and Donnal will do well enough. This team, this year, will require some patience. If we can get high level talent in the 16 class, this group of Frosh as Juniors mixed with elite talent could be very very good. My fingers are crossed.....Does anyone really have any confidence that we are going to lure 2-3 top fifty prospects for 16?
At this point I would be happy with 1
So I’m gonna go out on a limb here and say our best lineup includes Ricky Doyle
So I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say our best lineup includes Ricky Doyle
I do think he will be the best center option by the end of the season as long as he gets/stays healthy. Lack of DReb tonight is somewhat concerning.
So I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say our best lineup includes Ricky DoyleI do think he will be the best center option by the end of the season as long as he gets/stays healthy. Lack of DReb tonight is somewhat concerning.
No doubt, we got crushed underneath by a team that doesn’t have anyone in the rotation over 6’7". But things were a LOT worse when Doyle wasn’t in there.
Our best lineup definitely includes Ricky, but I prefer him coming off the bench. Let him get in when the other team is worn down and the beginning game jitters are over. You can see that Donnal fouls a bunch in the early going, and that’s something we want to avoid with Doyle.