I’m shocked at how bad Suggs has been. He was one of my favorites coming out of the draft and I thought for sure he had the highest floor (even if his ceiling was limited). Bones having such success makes me happy.
I still remain to this day baffled at how badly the NBA missed on Ayo. I know he isn’t likely to be a “star” but he seems likely to have a “leader of the second unit” role for years to come. I don’t understand how Davis, Murray, Ivey, etc. are all projected lottery guys and Ayo was a second round flyer.
I went back and forth on Ayo all year last year. You read the negative scouting reports in the draft box, then you watch the athleticism on the court. It was hard to reconcile those things. Hurts a ton that the Pistons passed on him.
Haha - we all have them. Then I try to find my good takes and they disappear into the abyss of my comment activity. Like @hack and @AC1997 and others, I am certain I had more than one post last year that said I felt Ayo was severely underrated and I’d gladly take him on my NBA squad. I said the same about Livers. But nope - can’t back those up…just that Suggs would be a stud and that “Chris Bosh” isn’t a good archetype anymore so Mobley is overrated.
Not that’s how I’d re-draft but DARKO would have it:
Barnes
Ziare
Franz
Mobley
Cade
Kuminga
Giddey
Duarte
Moody
Green
Suggs
Bouknight
Primo
IMO prob the big takeaway is that you have to take FT% shooting very seriously as an (the?) indicator of shotmaking skill, at least conditional on having some minimum athleticism? Suggs is probably the biggest downward re-rank and it’s largely bc he’s been dreadful shooting. 77% from the line is below NBA average. He’ll prob have better luck but his value is wrapped up in making either lots of difficult shots about average or somewhat fewer at a very high clip. Long way to go.
My argument in favor of Ago was that he had size and athleticism that could hold up in the NBA. My concern with Livers was not that he could shoot, but whether he could do enough elsewhere to stay on a roster.
Totally fair - I never meant to compare Ayo and Livers as having the same NBA ceiling. I just watched Ayo get whatever shot he wanted for 2+ years and didn’t understand how that wouldn’t translate to useful NBA player.
As for Livers, I just thought he was more than competent enough at being in the right position on defense that it could mask any other deficiencies…and his shooting stroke is just a thing of beauty, and I’d gladly park him on the perimeter if I have players who can drive and dish
Zeb’s school in the Toledo area was in a really bad conference. I played in that conference in HS. I was the center for my team and I was 5’11” at the time lol.
Transferred to play better competition. Could have gone to one of the other bball factories and played more I suppose.
Where’s Caleb Love going to end up? Kind of an Ivey-lite great athlete incredible in transition and iso ball, reasonable 3 pointer, maybe a question on how good he will be on D. Unfortunately he has a lot of data being not great on a bad team, doesn’t mean he couldn’t be great in the NBA and has the pedigree suggesting success
Looking at his shot results on Torvik, I don’t think Love and Ivey are terribly similar. I think they are both NBA athletes with good size. But Ivey is a great finisher, Love mediocre at best. Love made 38% of his threes this year on a really rough diet of mostly pull-ups, and is an 85% ft shooter - I think the kid can shoot.
His 2 point (and overall fg%) accuracy is held back by shot selection - he took 130 “long twos” this year, the lowest value shot in basketball. I think if you can coach that out of him, you have a pretty solid NBA guard.
