I’ve never suggested such a thing towards you and I hope you didn’t take that from my comments. I just find it funny how when it’s a player you’re not totally sold on you come on here and point out their weakness and pinpoint just how much they are lacking in any given area of their game, but if it’s someone your high on it seems you pass out biased glowing reviews.
No coming out of High school into college. I’m not speaking of the Pro ranks. Didn’t even mention the likes of Shamgod Wells. Go do some homework then get back to me. You have no Idea what constitutes Supreme Ball Handling skills if you think Nik had them.
Mannnn stop it. Kenny Anderson, Jamal Crawford and Jason Williams are examples of SUPREME BALL HANDLERS, Nik was at best a good ball handler. I saw the film back then and Dribbling skills exhibitions with no one guarding you does not constitute Supreme Ball Handling skills. Stay just as brutal with your assesment with players you like, don’t fluff it up.
Supreme ball handler? Or good ball handler? Smh.
ESPN local radio affiliate (presumably Albany) interview with Clint Jackson of Rivals with respect to Huerter posted today. Huerter has been recently offered by Iowa, Maryland, Miami (FL), Marquette, Xavier. Jackson says he’s been texting with Huerter for the past 3-4 days, and thinks UM and Syracuse (hometown) would be high on Huerter’s list if offered.
Described Huerter as ‘quick’, with good extension on his jumpshot. Initially gave a comparison to Bronson Koenig, before later on giving the inevitable Nik Stauskas comparison.
I just need to see more of Huerter…because if I’m being honest, the film above (against subpar competition) did not reflect Huerter as being quick, nor did it indicate that he had great extension on his jumpshot (doesn’t have a true jumpshot). Also, the comparison to Nik in HS is a bit extreme in my opinion, as Stauskas was a supreme ballhandler even in HS, I don’t see that in Huerter at all.
Edit - tweet below concerning elevation
Really like 2016 SG Kevin Huerter of City Rocks. 6-5 junior with a smooth floor game. Big time elevation on jumper.
Supreme…Stauskas was probably one of the 5 best ballhandlers in the country during HS, and his film reflected that.
Yes, those guys were supreme ballhandlers…in the professional ranks. Show me the film of said players in high school, if not, then it is just pure speculation on your behalf. Nik was certainly an elite ballhandler in HS, no doubt about it. Again, if you are that adamant about your views, just message me. Refuse to bicker about off topic dialogue.
And I’m the guy that is allegedly arrogant, with the superiority complex!
I've never suggested such a thing towards you and I hope you didn't take that from my comments. I just find it funny how when it's a player you're not totally sold on you come on here and point out their weakness and pinpoint just how much they are lacking in any given area of their game, but if it's someone your high on it seems you pass out biased glowing reviews.
No coming out of High school into college. I'm not speaking of the Pro ranks. Didn't even mention the likes of Shamgod Wells. Go do some homework then get back to me. You have no Idea what constitutes Supreme Ball Handling skills if you think Nik had them.
Mannnn stop it. Kenny Anderson, Jamal Crawford and Jason Williams are examples of SUPREME BALL HANDLERS, Nik was at best a good ball handler. I saw the film back then and Dribbling skills exhibitions with no one guarding you does not constitute Supreme Ball Handling skills. Stay just as brutal with your assesment with players you like, don't fluff it up.
Supreme ball handler? Or good ball handler? Smh.
ESPN local radio affiliate (presumably Albany) interview with Clint Jackson of Rivals with respect to Huerter posted today. Huerter has been recently offered by Iowa, Maryland, Miami (FL), Marquette, Xavier. Jackson says he's been texting with Huerter for the past 3-4 days, and thinks UM and Syracuse (hometown) would be high on Huerter's list if offered.
Described Huerter as ‘quick’, with good extension on his jumpshot. Initially gave a comparison to Bronson Koenig, before later on giving the inevitable Nik Stauskas comparison.
I just need to see more of Huerter…because if I’m being honest, the film above (against subpar competition) did not reflect Huerter as being quick, nor did it indicate that he had great extension on his jumpshot (doesn’t have a true jumpshot). Also, the comparison to Nik in HS is a bit extreme in my opinion, as Stauskas was a supreme ballhandler even in HS, I don’t see that in Huerter at all.
Edit - tweet below concerning elevation
Really like 2016 SG Kevin Huerter of City Rocks. 6-5 junior with a smooth floor game. Big time elevation on jumper.
Supreme…Stauskas was probably one of the 5 best ballhandlers in the country during HS, and his film reflected that.
Yes, those guys were supreme ballhandlers…in the professional ranks. Show me the film of said players in high school, if not, then it is just pure speculation on your behalf. Nik was certainly an elite ballhandler in HS, no doubt about it. Again, if you are that adamant about your views, just message me. Refuse to bicker about off topic dialogue.
And I’m the guy that is allegedly arrogant, with the superiority complex!
I point out positive attributes and weaknesses for all potential targets…just so happens that some players have more weaknesses in relation to others. In other words, if I’m not sold on someone, it’s because their film, or my eye, reflects or views such weaknesses that necessarily make said recruit a less attractive candidate for a roster spot…and I’d assume most people go through a similar analystic process. Long story short, not every player is made equal. You seem to think every recruit on the planet is above average/good at minimum. I just disagree. Still baffled that you didn’t like Stu Douglass though! In any event, I’m guilty of getting off topic, won’t go any further into the general evaluation topics.
I've never suggested such a thing towards you and I hope you didn't take that from my comments. I just find it funny how when it's a player you're not totally sold on you come on here and point out their weakness and pinpoint just how much they are lacking in any given area of their game, but if it's someone your high on it seems you pass out biased glowing reviews.
No coming out of High school into college. I'm not speaking of the Pro ranks. Didn't even mention the likes of Shamgod Wells. Go do some homework then get back to me. You have no Idea what constitutes Supreme Ball Handling skills if you think Nik had them.
Mannnn stop it. Kenny Anderson, Jamal Crawford and Jason Williams are examples of SUPREME BALL HANDLERS, Nik was at best a good ball handler. I saw the film back then and Dribbling skills exhibitions with no one guarding you does not constitute Supreme Ball Handling skills. Stay just as brutal with your assesment with players you like, don't fluff it up.
Supreme ball handler? Or good ball handler? Smh.
ESPN local radio affiliate (presumably Albany) interview with Clint Jackson of Rivals with respect to Huerter posted today. Huerter has been recently offered by Iowa, Maryland, Miami (FL), Marquette, Xavier. Jackson says he's been texting with Huerter for the past 3-4 days, and thinks UM and Syracuse (hometown) would be high on Huerter's list if offered.
Described Huerter as ‘quick’, with good extension on his jumpshot. Initially gave a comparison to Bronson Koenig, before later on giving the inevitable Nik Stauskas comparison.
I just need to see more of Huerter…because if I’m being honest, the film above (against subpar competition) did not reflect Huerter as being quick, nor did it indicate that he had great extension on his jumpshot (doesn’t have a true jumpshot). Also, the comparison to Nik in HS is a bit extreme in my opinion, as Stauskas was a supreme ballhandler even in HS, I don’t see that in Huerter at all.
Edit - tweet below concerning elevation
Really like 2016 SG Kevin Huerter of City Rocks. 6-5 junior with a smooth floor game. Big time elevation on jumper.
Supreme…Stauskas was probably one of the 5 best ballhandlers in the country during HS, and his film reflected that.
Yes, those guys were supreme ballhandlers…in the professional ranks. Show me the film of said players in high school, if not, then it is just pure speculation on your behalf. Nik was certainly an elite ballhandler in HS, no doubt about it. Again, if you are that adamant about your views, just message me. Refuse to bicker about off topic dialogue.
And I’m the guy that is allegedly arrogant, with the superiority complex!
Webb, looks to me like you’re just itching to point out something, anything that Matt could be wrong about. He never said all-time, and sure your interpretation of ‘supreme’ could be different than his or mine, but what difference does it make? He points out strengths and weaknesses of guys, some don’t agree, but you don’t have to. And you make it clear that you don’t by disagreeing with d*mn near every post he makes.
Great ball handling takes on many different looks, Nash was never as flashy as Curry but does that make him any less effective on the court? Iverson’s cross was much more dramatic that Hardaway Sr. but does that make his better? People never attribute ball handling to John Stockton, but he rarely turned the ball over (career 4:1 Ast:TO). I know this is waaay off-topic, so I’ll stop.
Sorry for jumping into an off-topic convo. On Huerter, I think he a is a secondary or tertiary ball handler at best. Nice shooter and can be an effective passer within an offense. Does look like he has good court vision (offensively and defensively)) and a willingness to pass. Doesn’t seem to be adept at gaining separation off the dribble, but can get by in HS because of his height. Doesn’t seem to utilize his vertical on his shot, but it could be an instance of him not needing to at this level. Also seems to like the fact that he can attack an open rim, but doesn’t display the same aggression when going to the rim with a defender.
I do think we limit ourselves in these conversations by not looking at players’ potential. I think that Beilein has made his bones by seeing beyond and–of course–seeing what a given player might do in his offense/in tandem with current players. I know MattD has argued for a more face-value take and he clearly is a good evaluator, but there’s a reason some of these guys are sophomores and juniors, 16, 17 years old.
On a tangential note, it takes some evaluative awareness to note when a player looks good because he’s facing inferior high school talent. It takes more skill still to project that player into B1G contexts, not just a year down the road but sometimes 2 or 3. We have been decimated by early departures, but I think one huge ace in the hole that a good non-Kentucky school like Michigan can play over time is in being able to bank these guys, RS them, etc. and see them emerge as fine junior or senior players. This goes especially for the bigs. Hats off to some of these guys who by spring have absorbed Beilein’s system and start thriving in it.
When I evaluate kids UM is looking at, I try as best as I can to look through UM’s coaching staffs eyes.
IMO, I think JB see’s Huerter as a combo…think a considerably more polished version of Stu Douglass. He may not be a creator in the the Burke, Morris, Walton mold, but he has more than enough ball skills to get an outlet and lead the break and/or initiate half court offense. Certainly, the need for him to be a creator will depend on who is playing with…are the 2 and/or 3 players that can get into the lane and create.
The thing I also look at with Huerter is, he’s clearly not done developing physically. He may not grow taller but I think there is plenty of room for athletic improvements in terms of strength and quickness.
Anybody else look at Huerter and think of McQuaid…just in terms of physical dimensions/shooting ability. I like Huerter’s ball skills better, but think McQuaid is the better athlete.
I love guys who can pass…and whether or not it’s against bad competition, I think Huerter’s ability as a passer in terms of willingness and accuracy separate him as a just a shooter. In ever saw McQuaid as more than a shooter.
I love guys who can pass...and whether or not it's against bad competition, I think Huerter's ability as a passer in terms of willingness and accuracy separate him as a just a shooter. In ever saw McQuaid as more than a shooter.
Certainly agree that McQuad isn’t a passer, just saw similarity in terms of physical dimensions and shooting ability.
On the passing - need to see more in halfcourt setting against legit competition. Probably 90% of his passing highlights were transition outlet passes against horrible defenses…not sold on that…yet. Need to see film against legit competition in a half court set.
On high school, and in his freshman year at Michigan, I would not call Nik a “supreme” ballhandler. He dribbled the ball well, but was mainly a spot up shooter as a freshman. Against top defensive competition in the tourney (Cuse, Louisville), he really struggled.
As a sophomore, he ran the pick and roll to perfection. He is a very good dribbler, but never got to the rim with a ton of quickness. I would call him more of a great passer than a great creator. That’s what I see with this Huerter kid. He may take a year or two to be quick enough and strong enough to handle the ball effectively, but he’s got really nice vision, and his shot is really nice.
Not sure McQuaid is more athletic, just 2-3 inches taller.
I would certainly consider offering this kid as a point.
The more I watch Huerter’s film, the more I want him. He has all the tools. He already is more explosive than most everyone on our team (that’s sad but true). Get him in a college S&C program and this kid could be special. One of the most impressive things a high school player can do is go full speed down the court and pull up on a dime and knock down the shot. I don’t care what the competition is, if you can do this, you can play. Huerter does this in these clips. Think MattD is selling him a little short in regards to his jump shot. I think he has a nice jump shot off the bounce and it’s only going to improve the stronger he gets.
I agree that he’s not a PG though. He’s a 2/3 that in a pinch can bring the ball up. Would I offer him as a PG? If it meant him signing with us, absolutely. I would then stick MAAR on him first practice and whisper in MAAR’s ear, “Eat him up” and make the kid realize, maybe he’s a better fit at the 2/3.
I’m far more concerned about this kid on the defense side of the ball than offensively. Can he guard anyone? I have no clue off these clips. His defensive stance needs a ton of work.
On high school, and in his freshman year at Michigan, I would not call Nik a “supreme” ballhandler. He dribbled the ball well, but was mainly a spot up shooter as a freshman. Against top defensive competition in the tourney (Cuse, Louisville), he really struggled.
As a sophomore, he ran the pick and roll to perfection. He is a very good dribbler, but never got to the rim with a ton of quickness. I would call him more of a great passer than a great creator. That’s what I see with this Huerter kid. He may take a year or two to be quick enough and strong enough to handle the ball effectively, but he’s got really nice vision, and his shot is really nice.
Not sure McQuaid is more athletic, just 2-3 inches taller.
I would certainly consider offering this kid as a point.
Nik was more efficient in PnR as a freshman than Trey. Perhaps supreme holds a different meaning to all…but the point in functional terms is that Nik was much, much better at handling the ball in HS in relation to Huerter.
McQuaid is actually shorter than Huerter according to some sites, and certainly not 2-3 inches taller. McQuaid is just better vertically in my opinion.
The more I watch Huerter's film, the more I want him. He has all the tools. He already is more explosive than most everyone on our team (that's sad but true). Get him in a college S&C program and this kid could be special. One of the most impressive things a high school player can do is go full speed down the court and pull up on a dime and knock down the shot. I don't care what the competition is, if you can do this, you can play. Huerter does this in these clips. Think MattD is selling him a little short in regards to his jump shot. I think he has a nice jump shot off the bounce and it's only going to improve the stronger he gets.
I agree that he’s not a PG though. He’s a 2/3 that in a pinch can bring the ball up. Would I offer him as a PG? If it meant him signing with us, absolutely. I would then stick MAAR on him first practice and whisper in MAAR’s ear, “Eat him up” and make the kid realize, maybe he’s a better fit at the 2/3.
I’m far more concerned about this kid on the defense side of the ball than offensively. Can he guard anyone? I have no clue off these clips. His defensive stance needs a ton of work.
Not selling him short on the jumpshot, as I do think he can shoot. Just not enough evidence to say he can shoot off the bounce against legit comp. The film I posted does reflect some ability to hit midrange shots off the bounce, but very limited in terms of quantity. His primary value at this point, based on film I’ve seen, is catch and shoot.
On high school, and in his freshman year at Michigan, I would not call Nik a “supreme” ballhandler. He dribbled the ball well, but was mainly a spot up shooter as a freshman. Against top defensive competition in the tourney (Cuse, Louisville), he really struggled.
As a sophomore, he ran the pick and roll to perfection. He is a very good dribbler, but never got to the rim with a ton of quickness. I would call him more of a great passer than a great creator. That’s what I see with this Huerter kid. He may take a year or two to be quick enough and strong enough to handle the ball effectively, but he’s got really nice vision, and his shot is really nice.
Nik was very efficient in ball screens as a freshman. He wasn’t used there all that much because of Trey and Timmy’s presence, but he performed very well:
Part of this, and part of the reason he was so good sophomore year, despite not always getting “to the rim with a ton of quickness,” was his ballhandling.
This is important when projecting HS kids to college or frosh to sophs, etc. – i.e., when projecting how good Caris or Zak or Derrick or Dawkins will be next year, or how good Huerter could be in college. Of course, Huerter could improve his ball-handling, or use other skills to overcome less adept ball handling, but I wouldn’t dismiss Nik’s handles in projecting others. And you don’t have to be as good as Nik to run a PnR. You could see Zak’s improved handles really help him as the year progressed.
Bottom line for me is that if a recruit doesn’t have average/above average handles at minimum, it really mitigates your utility. Sure, a player can shoot, but unless that player can create space, it justs less efficient to take contested jumpshots without space…and I’m sure we can all concede to that. Same thing with passing…unless you can handle the ball well enough to get past the onball defender and draw help defense, the passing ability is mitigated because the player is essentially passing to a teammate that is defended as opposed to passing to a teammate in a position to catch and score.
In my opinion, ballhandling is the #1 trait for any guard/wing player at any level…just much more utility for those types of players irrelevant of any other skill. Catch and shoot players are what I label ‘dependent’ players…to a certain extent they can only be as good as the ballhandlers surrounding them.
There is nothing in Huerter’s film suggests he isn’t anything below an average ball handler. As a Jr, I think it’s clear, based on his ever growing offer list and interest of high major programs, this kid can play.
And taking into consideration what I know JB values, I think this kid would be a great fit.
