Michigan vs. Detroit Discussion


#82

But… he got fouled. You don’t count ‘missed’ shots on fouls because they are fouls and you get free throw attempts. FWIW, Teske also has 4 and-ones this year, 1 less than Moe and 2 less than Charles.


#83

Adding four inches to a vertical seems like a massive ask for a guy that has already spent a year and a half in a CBB S&C program. I don’t know what his vertical is right now, but I feel like he would become the greatest rim defender in program history, easily, if he added four more inches.


#84

This was being said before that game. He needs to finish and-one opportunities where he’s lightly fouled or it’s a bad call also. I know @umhoops put the one less than Moe stat out, but I’ve seen several misses that you’d eventually want him to make. Doesn’t mean he’s bad, just that there’s room for improvement.

I also think it’s important to realize that that was probably the worst opponent we’ll face this year when you combine quality and effort. I think even A&M will play like they want to win somewhat.


#85

This is all fair, and I am really just talking about the game thread, where everyone’s emotions are prey to the up and down of a game. But his chemistry on the pick n’ roll and with some of the interior passing looked pretty good, in fact. And I think that if you dig further into the stats several of those misses came with their own asterisks; there was really only 1 instance, IIRC, where he just failed to go up strong and missed.


#86

Yeah, I guess I’m not trying to say that Jon can’t improve as a finisher. He certainly can, especially in tougher spots. I’m just pointing out that by the numbers he’s probably better than what meets the eye test.


#87

I mean he’s already probably in the top half of Big Ten backup centers, if not the top third, so he’s certainly following the developmental path that you’d want/expect. I guess it’s good that we’re able to nitpick about stuff like finishing from a statistically decent finisher and not have to worry about stuff like defense or effort.


#88

I think because of his size, some people think that he should be able to make every shot from in close.


#89

I never read the game thread and wouldn’t want to post my mid-game thoughts, so I don’t know what was said about Teske there (but can imagine). As for chemistry, even against Detroit, there was a pass from Brooks off a PnR that sailed right through Teske’s hands (unless it was Davis and I’m remembering incorrectly). Pass was a little hard and could’ve been put a little softer and further away, while Teske also could’ve been more ready for it. I think that’ll be an easy dunk sometime soon. Both are playing well now and I’ve been a huge Teske fan all this year – I just think he’s got a ways to go until he hits his ceiling.


#90

The PNR pass that Brooks threw was more of a bad pass than anything wrong with Teske. Here’s the clip if we are talking about the same play.


#91

Wow, that was fast, thanks. It does look to be more on the pass, though I think Brooks is also passing over the shorter defender – either way it speaks to chemistry between the two. Next year or even later this year that’s a dunk.

As for the stats discussion, Teske is shooting 58% from the line, so expected value of an and-one is 2.58 points vs two FTs which is 1.16 – that’s a big difference. This is about what could propel Teske in the future from being a good player to being a top-line guy.

Also, Teske has gone 4-11 against high major competition (LSU, UNC, IU, OSU, UCLA, and Texas). He did got 3-4 against VCU, but even that would put him below 50%. Granted, Texas had Bamba and NC had size and the game was kind of a debacle and he was 0-5 in those two games, so we probably shouldn’t make too much of that.

The upside of Mo’s injury was getting Teske a bunch of minutes and hopefully that pays off going forward. Having him to back up Mo is a great luxury and he could be a real factor for Michigan even if his minutes are limited.


#92

I really like Teske and he’s been much better than anticipated. My word choice seems to have caused a lack of clarity. I might better have said I don’t think Teske will ever be a star, rather than saying he’s a role player. Like senior season Jordan Morgan; very good player, but definitely a role player


#93

Yeah, good point, you might be right on second thought… It is not that uncommon for a player to increase 3 or 4 inches after their first year but he has already been here awhile. Plus, if he were to gain 4 inches on his vertical it would be a higher than normal % increase because his vertical is already pretty low relative to other players…


#94

Since this has become a Teske conversation, my thoughts on Teske…
he’s developing into a Jordan Morgan role, in my opinion. And I mean that as a complement. Morgan was the backbone to the team’s defense and often made plays when UM needed key late game stops. Similarly, I think UM’s defense is better this year when Teske is on the floor. (Teske is a better shot blocker than Morgan, but Morgan was so good at reading the offense and calling out help for the perimeter defenders).

Neither Teske nor Morgan are focal points of the offense, but both have/had an ability to clean up “junk” plays.


#95

Morgan was a super-bright guy and became a leader/QB when he was in there. Guy was so valuable. Also an example of a player who fans could be silly in maligning.


#96

From the start, I thought both Teske and Davis had the potential to surpass Morgan level of play by the later years of their careers. Morgan was pretty bad early on. He had limited offensive skills, wasn’t a great leaper and couldn’t catch the ball. I think both of our current guys came in with better skills. Other than 5 star caliber players, most centers take a few years to develope.


#97

Yeah I think there are certainly plays where we wish (much like DJ last year) that he would just dunk/finish because he’s capable. But the stats bear out that he gets the job done more than not.

My only beef was with the actual broadcast, and not with our fanbase who (at least on this site) come with a plethora of facts to back up development. The two announcers of the game were only referencing those 2 plays I mentioned way above as evidence that he needs to learn to finish strong, and I just didn’t think either of those plays applied.


#98

People used to rag on JMo for his finishing so much. And the dude set a record for best FG%, IIRC. Fans often assume Centers should hit every shot around the basket which is just not a realistic expectation obviously.


#99

Well I think part of the griping comes from shots missed that would have been 100% makes if they were dunked, which is why so many people want a center with hops for once.


#100

Well if they can dunk everytime around the basket than they are either a 5 Star center or have no other skills.


#101

What is Bamba’s shooting %, or MSU’s Jackson? Those guys both have pretty good hops. Are they shooting 100%.