Michigan at Michigan State Discussion Thread


#222

Winston and Loyer will be a hilarious defensive point guard rotation for the next two years


#223

I saw this circulating on Anthony Wright’s twitter and I’ve had some arguments with my Sparty friends about it.

Who would win a 7 game series between 2012-2013 Michigan and this year’s MSU team? Before the last week or so I was actually tempted to say MSU in 7 but then yesterday made me realize how badly Burke would eat Winston alive…


#224

Yeah, Winston is just slow. The reason he can even compete is he has an impressive bag of tricks. I admire him for that to some extent but if you look at his drives they almost always involve an offensive foul and a travel. Instead of a jump stop he gallops and then takes extra steps. He also has this very craft thing where he gathers the ball, takes a step, and then lets the ball go loose, regathers the ball and then takes extra steps–effectively giving him an extra step or two…It gives the illusion that he is not traveling but he is…Not putting him down exactly, as he is doing what he needs to do to be competitive and the refs need to be a bit more savy but it is what is. Winston is slow.


#225

If MSU doesn’t win the Big Ten they have absolutely no excuse. The schedule was gift-wrapped for them: one game apiece against Purdue, Michigan and OSU - and two of those at home! And now they’re 0-2 against that trio…


#226

Winston seems like an undersized 2 playing out of position. Against a quick PG in Simpson he was overmatched at both ends - couldn’t beat Simpson’s D, couldn’t stop Simpson from getting in the lane. Not sure how MSU can hide this. I guess they could play Nairn more, but then it’s 4 on 5 on offense.


#227

Agreed. Sparty’s conference schedule this year is shamefully easy. Thankfully they haven’t looked like the run away winner many of us, myself included, thought they would be.


#228

I’d say:
So. Burke > So. Winston
Fr. Nik = So. Langford
Jr Hardaway = So. Bridges
Fr. GR3 < Fr. JJJ
Fr. Mitch (albeit, peak Mitch) > So. Ward
7 seasons total experience < 9 seasons total experience…but Mich looked way more seasoned composed. Granted, all of the MSU players have only played half a season, still plenty of time for young players to get better and time for a young team to gel.

Having Timmy and Bridges as a push might result from my bias. Timmy could create his own offense and a better shooter; Bridges is a better rebounder and physical specimen (I think he is also 3rd on their team in assists).

But the bench might be an even bigger advantage:
Fr. Spike > Sr. Tum Tum
Fr. Caris > Jr. McQuiad
Jr. Morgan > Sr. Schilling


#229

Trends aren’t linear. With MSU’s talent I expect them to rip off a huge win streak at some point.


#230

I agree that they should win quite a few because their schedule is easy. But they will never be top 5 again, during regular season. That is over, imo.


#231

It’s a good bet that MSU wins there next 7 games before facing Purdue. They will be back in the top 5 in just a couple of weeks.


#232

Certainly possible, but then, who’d have expected them to go to OT with a bad Rutgers team?


#233

In his post game comments, Izzo said of the two losses last week: ‘It’s just two games. Big deal.” I never thought I would hear him talk that way after losing games, especially when he thinks he has a final four team.


#234

Izzo probably knows what the “big deal” is but does not want to admit it. Here is the big deal: You are supposedly a HOF coach, and your team, stocked with very coveted recruits, is underachieving. Either he is failing them as a coach or is not very good at realistically assessing what he has—evidenced by his comments that this is the best team he has ever had. It’s not just the bad week either. There have been multiple first halves this year where MSU just looks like an undisciplined bunch of guys, without high basketball IQ, and with bad habits. Not enough toughness? I don’t think so. Their plan was to bully their way to a national championship. The potential was there to see great things happen by combining toughness and fundamentals but I don’t see it happening anymore and not because of a lack of toughness. I do see the Izzo is a genius narrative eroding a bit…Izzo is in damage control mode when he claims “no big deal”.


#235

They’ve lost three games. College hoops is a marathon not a sprint. Remember back in 2013 when the sky was falling because Michigan got dominated in East Lansing or completely fell apart in State College?


#236

Man, that was a rough stretch. 6-6 before the national championship game run.


#237

Ugh, that Penn State loss was brutal.


#238

They have had long stretches where they looked boneheaded in games they won. 3-3 against kenpom top 50. They are a good team but pointing out their flaws is relative to the expectation of them being one of the clear front runners for a National Championship.


#239

Somehow that team that started out 19-1 ended up with a 4 seed. Which I still think was an unfair seed but it all worked out.


#240

They’ve won one game by single digits. If you liked Michigan State two weeks ago, you should still like Michigan State IMO.

Their perimeter depth is their biggest weakness and Josh Langford will need to play well in the tourney for them. I’d still bet on the best rim defending team in the country to make a long run in the tourney.


#241

How would you access their schedule until now? I would say they have played a handful of good teams and gone 3-3 against top 50 kenpom. The rest has been pretty much cupcake city. Moving forward their schedule looks very easy as big ten schedules go…They should win a lot of games in conference. I watch almost all of their games closely. They have great strengths but also glaring weaknesses. There have been long stretches in games that became eventual blowouts where they do not look like a national contender. My tune would be different if those guys were inexperienced Sophmores playing with a Freshman. The Sophmores have a ton of college experience and yet they look like Freshman at times. There is nothing overwhelming about their bench either.