Big Ten Tournament Discussion Thread


Agree with the comments about Izzo refusing to compliment Michigan. His arguments are ridiculous though. Michigan shot what 9 of 25 from 3. Simpson was 1 of 3 which is right around his average. Matthews was 2 of 4 which, if he made 1 is below his average (in other words he made one more shot than normal). But you can’t talk about those and ignore then Duncan Robinson missed two wide open shots he normally makes, that Wagner missed some great looks he normally makes and still complain about the ones that went in. If we shot 60 pct from 3 and you said something about Simpson and Matthews making 3s and his you can’t do much about that I get it, but we didn’t shoot great from outside, pretty average actually. Of course he never mentioned the prayer of a 3 by bridges that had no business going in (because he was fouled on it). Lot of sour grapes.


Izzo is an Angry Dwarf who is “never wrong.”


Two separate thoughts here:

  1. While I obviously badly want a win today, and I’ve been frustrated by our two near-wins against Purdue, I have to admit I actually like these guys some. I was hoping we’d land Vince Edwards here four years ago, and have always loved his game. Carsen Edwards is my person POY vote, over KBD. Mathias is exactly the sort of guy I feel I should hate, but he’s just so useful in every facet. I don’t particularly like Haas, but that Dutch kid with all the hair cracks me up. I’ve always liked Painter - an actually gracious coach…

…which brings me to #2 (and I hesitate to inject Real World problems into sports fandom, but here it is). I’m not from the state of Michigan, so I didn’t grow up with the UM/MSU rivalry, and have generally been much more agnostic about it than most of my classmates at Michigan. What I’m saying: I’m not a blind Sparty hater, in the least - I like Draymond, I liked Delvon Roe, Gary Harris. But Izzo, not to belabor the point, is a horrible man. He’s petty, he’s ungracious, he’s egotistical, and that’s the least of his flaws. I don’t care about paying players in the least, but his list of sins from a disciplinary standpoint - for horrible crimes - is long, thorough, and inexcusable. I genuinely hope his legacy is taken from him, root and stem - it’s what he deserves.


Appreciate this post. There was a stretch where MSU was relying strongly on bullying, and on the refs unwillingness to call every foul. They set the tone for the league and the league became darn near unwatchable. Somewhere between that stretch, Izzo’s growing vindictiveness, and the recent tragedies (now seems irrefutable that Izzo protected his players from justice after some really ugly things they did to women), I started feeling pretty hostile to the whole enterprise. But I have to admit that I found Beilein’s comments about not hating MSU, just loving Michigan, so charming–and disarming–that I realized Michigan is now in a very, very good place. We can let some of this crap wash past us; they have made their bed.


Cassius’ struggles versus Zavier are interesting because they directly reflect what happened to him in high school. Throughout high school, he would consistently struggle against quick athletic guards like Josh McFolley and Brailen Neeley (I think this is something I’ve mentioned on this forum before?). IIRC UD went 1-3 in Operation Friendship during his career and it was primarily because he couldn’t handle the athleticism mismatch versus PSL guards.


Hell, our crappy tiny high school would shut him down by putting a quick guy on him. He’s actually done far better than I would’ve expected after facing him in high school, but it’s obvious how slow laterally he is.


He looked scared yesterday. So did several members of the team. And the replay showed that they spent a lot of time pointing fingers at one another. Izzo will need to work hard to get them back on the same page or they will stumble early in the tournament. I still think they will be vulnerable to any intense, well-organized squad. In fact, intensity might be a better byword for what they lack than toughness.


Great psychological insights, guys!

Our team is mentally tough and just plain tough. Again, Ward looked like a fake-wannabe-tough guy when he tried to flex on our guys. Matthews, z, Wagner, Poole, Livers good luck trying to intimidate those guys. Then there is MAAR. The dude is cold blooded—unaffected by any of the tough guy routines.

Love this team. Love this team’s love and support for each other!

I have a lot respect for Purdue. If we can beat them it is going to be a major achievement! Fingers crossed.


I can see us having more fans but I don’t know about 8-1 - there are probably a fair number of Purdue fans that booked vacations in NY for this event, like fans would for a bowl game.


Re: Izzo, I’ve always found him to be petty and insincere. But back when we were terrible, bringing this up made you look like a sore loser. All that’s changed is that we now hold our own in the rivalry, and Beilein has shown what winning with class actually looks like.

But I do love that Beilein takes the high road. No one ever has a bad word to say about the man.


“Winston has been the best offensive player in the conference by a pretty decent margin”



I think BleedBlue meant to say, he’s the best three point shooter by a wide margin, but I don’t want to put words in his mouth. He’s normally an excellent passer and his three point percentage speaks for itself, but I certainly agree, he’s not the best offensive player in the conference. How about it Bleed, is an edit in order?


I’m just telling you that I’ve been here all week and I’ve seen a bunch of PU fans, but not a ton at all.

Meanwhile, easily every 2nd person is wearing maize and blue.


In a fairly judged comparison (when Beilein first had only his recruits on a team in 2011) Beilein is 9-7 against Izzo and holds a 67% NCAA tourney win percentage compared to 63% for Izzo. Quite interesting.


And that 9-7 mark includes an 0-3 stretch in the two years where our backcourt was crippled by injuries (14-15 and 15-16).

Basically, when we have comparable talent to MSU, we win most of the time.


Trey Burkes NPOY O-Rating: 123.4
Cassius Winston’s, this year: 131.8


Albeit on a 23% usage rate compared to Burke’s 29%


Does Teske read this board? Cause since I posted this he’s had 3 swats into the stands. Go job big fella!


Yeah, even if Moe goes pro I feel very comfortable with the starting center situation next season.


True, but still on another level of every other alpha in the conference.