Yeah, I guess if all people are saying is making fun of not being able to hire Brad Stevens (that isn’t really unique to this coaching search, BTW… Michigan fans were going on about Billy Donovan, etc.). I just think people are more down on the “job” than I’d expect.
Yes but we aren’t talking about Beilein in the WVU context. We are talking about the Beilein who went to two finals, went to several sweet 16s and won Big Ten hardware. And somehow that hire would be frowned upon and universally hated?
3 Likes
Like the username! Fwiw.
1 Like
I know but why would that make him interested in Indiana? I swear I am not playing dumb, I just don’t see how it tracks. That would be like us hiring one of JB’s WVU assistants
3 Likes
It’s an excellent job. But the conversation here seems to be in the context of poo-pooing JB because they think they are going to land Stevens or Beard or Drew. I would be surprised. And Beilein then should be a well-liked hire among realistic candidates
I would put the Indiana basketball head coaching position on the same level as the Michigan football head coaching position. Tons of history, tons of money, but losing prestige and not considered a top 5 place to land, IMO.
My take is that it’s a good job. Best job on the market right now. They can easily land JB, I think. But it’s not a good enough job to get coaches who are F4 contenders at their current job, getting paid a ton and are great cultural fits for their current spot to leave and come and fix them.
I think only KU, UK, UNC and probably Duke are at that level. For gods sake, UCLA had to hire Cronin.
3 Likes
I don’t care much about the Indiana fans, every job JB has taken came with the same type of critics. We should know soon enough if JB wants to coach, and if he does, he’s earned the right to do that at any school. If he coaches again, you can bet he will be a winner and those critics will be on the bandwagon! Everywhere in the college game he has held the highest ethical standard, developed his players and left the team in much batter shape than when he started. If he ever coaches against Michigan, it will be one hell of a game day thread! You know he will handle it with grace and poise in the JB way! Good luck to John!
1 Like
Gotta presume that their real objection is age? Since the Michigan football comparison is impossible to avoid, I’d like to say that if there were a 65+ coach on the market who is a proven program builder/turnaround artist who would stay for 5 years but leave us on solid ground once gone, sign me up for that yes please. But maybe IUBB people haven’t taken enough pain yet.
1 Like
And don’t forget unrealistic sky high expectations from the fans and alumni. They act like it’s a top 5 job no matter what and they can get anyone they want.
Okay that’s fair. I think that it still has some juice though. As far as recruiting, you can get guys just because it’s Indiana. There aren’t that many schools with that baked in. And Indiana is a fertile recruiting ground.
A school like Michigan has all the resources but you need a recruiter to get guys. Right now UM is getting guys because of Juwan Howard.
2 Likes
May be homerism talking but I find it nuts that Beard and Drew are ahead of JB on that pecking order. Stevens, sure. But I would say that JB has a longer track record of success than the other 2 and is a midwest guy where the other 2 are not and could have some issues with cultural fit.
It also isn’t football, which generally takes longer to get things moving in the right direction. Even if this is only a 6-7 year gig for Beilein, he won the B1G in Year 5, went to the national title in Year 6 and won the B1G again in Year 7 at Michigan.
3 Likes
Those guys could be longer term hires than JB, I think that gives them the edge
I think the reality is that most fans who post on message boards (present company excluded) are going to be clamoring for the home run hire who is young, recruits at an elite level, and runs an entertaining system. Thus you’re going to get the Brad Stevens or Billy Donovan type of wish list candidates. Beilein is a “boring” hire that is going to run a methodical system that you learn to appreciate, he’s shown the potential to recruit well but isn’t going to chase 5-stars, and he’s at the tail end of his career. Those fans posting about him in a negative way are also not the ones in the AD or whatever search firm they hired.
Frankly, Beilein would probably be a better hire for Minnesota where he won’t have delusional fans and expectations short term and could build a sustainable program…though it is a lot farther away than IU. I still think ND is the job he’d prefer - lots of resources, not in the B10, modest expectations, etc.
Minnesota is the spot for Beilein. He gets to bake Richard’s championship cake and take all of the credit. Ball is on the tee. Meanwhile Richard will be putting together another masterpiece elsewhere that he’ll likely never get the credit for.
2 Likes
To be sure, Indiana can and should make Brad Stevens say no before anything else happens. The weird covid schedule makes it hard to wait until the end of the Celtics season, however.
I do think this is true to an extent, but I’m not sure HOW true it still is. Crean was able to get some solid recruiting near the end of his tenure, but the early Crean era and the entire Archie era was basically built on landing top in-state recruits and nothing else (I believe that Jerome Hunter is the only top 100 out of state recruit Archie ever landed). I think you’d have to say that Archie is a very very weak recruiter if you want to say that Indiana still has strong cache outside of its home state.
That could be the case, but I’m still interested in seeing it tested. Indiana being the primary school in a fertile recruiting ground is definitely a very strong plus that the Michigan job doesn’t have though. Seems like Michigan has a real disproportionate number of players leaving the state and then no longer having a connection to the in-state schools (I weep that Jaden Hardy never came close to happening).
I wouldnt say iu has anymore recruiting pull than michigan, more in their own state which has better talent than michigan but similar in the midwest(along with msu and osu) and michigan more nationally. Until the sanctions hit and um signed more mcdonalds aa’s than every school but uk, unc, duke and ucla and that was under several different coaches. The big recruiting benefit at iu is they are in such great sate for talent where kids are massively pushed to go there. Beilein would recruit similar there to at um imo.
Not speaking against John, because I love him. But here are the objections that I think might be raised against an IU candidacy, based on perceptions of his style:
- Slow build to wins. Style takes a while to teach, is complicated.
- Already well on in years, which with number 1. means hire is risky.
- Not a recruiter of first-rate talent, but coaxes the most out of underevalued players. IU, fans have to believe, can get the McDonald’s All Americans. (Would his hard-to-teach style work if players are leaving after a year?)
- Not an aggressive recruiter, criteria (not dissimilar from Juwan Howard’s, interestingly) may mean missing out on talent.
- Maybe too nice.
Gotta say, I don’t see too many coaches out there with the built-in advantages that Juwan Howard has. I understand why they want Stevens. And–let’s be honest–Stevens would be fun to have in the league.
If I were John I’d go to Minnesota, where the expectations are reduced. . . and coming out of the other end of a five-year last hurrah with a solid program on an upward trajectory could prove enjoyable/attainable. Why endure Indiana fans?
Yes, Indiana is a program with pedigree, but not one where winning is assured at this stage. Five years ago, yes–John could have been a kind of John Wooden figure there–could have expunged the tainted legacy of Bob Knight. . . They don’t want a saint at this stage; they’re desperate for wins.
6 Likes