Duncan will have 2 years of eligibility left (assuming no grad year) and Wilson will be in the same boat. Not someone I would take over Seth Towns but I expect them to play two diff. roles in the offense.
Good catch, Duncan will have only 2 years left.
Just think kids like this are a dime a dozen. This kid’s ceiling would seem to be Schurna from NW. Even if we were to land Towns, I just don’t see the need for this kid. Towns is the shooter/handler in one…you can find other shooters that are more athletic and can defend better.
I’m going to see him live a week from Friday. I’ll report back. I’m hesitant to evaluate him off of sophomore tape–as you, yourself pointed out with respect to Towns, his tape this year looks vastly different from his tape last year.
Two comments about what you said. First, I’d take John Shurna in a New York minute. These are Shurna’s stats for his soph-senior seasons at Northwestern–18.3 ppg, 5.4 rpg, over 250 assists, with a 1.6/1 assist/turnover ratio, and an effective field goal percentage of 56.0%. I’m, not saying this kid will be Shurna, but Shurna’s are not a dime a dozen. He was first team All Big Ten as a senior (second team as a soph), and an honorable mention All-American his senior year. I don’t care how funky his shot looked, or how gangly he appeared, he produced, and did so on respectable Northwestern teams which beat a lot of good teams while he was there and the man on his team.
Second, while Towns may be better, we’re no lock to get Towns. I agree that there would be no reason to take both Towns and this kid, even if this kid is good enough, but our recruiting issues have made it clear that you need to look at multiple options.
Certainly agree with you it’s hard to evaluate from film 1 year ago, that’s why I made the disclaimer…he could be much better at this point.
While I do understand Shurna was effective at NW, his stats are inflated because he played for bad teams. Could he have produced like that at UM. Doubt it. From the film above, Ivanauskas looks very one dimensional, and can’t play a lick of defense/rebounding. I’ll take a pass if his game hasn’t significantly improved
I agree that Shurna’s stats were inflated by playing for Northwester, though one might argue that on a lesser team, where you are getting most of the attention, you are less likely to be efficient, and more likely to be a volume shooter/scorer, and Shurna was, in fact, very efficient. That said, if Shurna would have produced at Michigan at the level of say Zak Irvin this year, or maybe even Zack Novak as a senior, he’s still a contributor I’d like to have provided that he’s not the best or second best player on your team. Context matters. If John Shurna is part of a class with two great players, or a team with three or four great ones, I’m all in. If he’s your lynchpin, then you likely have issues. Put into class of '16 context, IF this kid is Shurna-like, and he’s part of a class with two of Battle, Langford, Winston, etc., then he’s potentially a very valuable piece. If he’s the best player in the class, uh oh. FWIW, I think that of Towns as well.
Again, I have no opinion of Ivanauskas until I see him live–just a theoretical discussion.
Would take a kid like Shurma any time. I can confidently say Duncan Robinson will not remotely approach Shurma’s career when all is said and done. Players that “produce” come in all shapes and sizes, and the fact that Shurma was so efficient in the face of focused defensive game planning, just proves his worth. How was Caris doing with the increased D attention? Have no clue regarding Ivanauskas, plus the film is ( as Matt said ) so old.
All we’re doing is watching Ivanauskas at this point. The film above is almost a year old. Soph to junior year can be a big change physically and game-wise. Purdue has already offered, so I’m guessing that he’s progressed since a year ago.
All we're doing is watching Ivanauskas at this point. The film above is almost a year old. Soph to junior year can be a big change physically and game-wise. Purdue has already offered, so I'm guessing that he's progressed since a year ago.
UA offered Chatman - what did it really mean in the end?
As you say, he could have improved immensely since march. But based on the film above, I’m not impressed
Did a bit more digging on Ivanauskas - came up with a bit more film from December 2014. He just doesn’t impress me, his shot release is very slow, below average/poor athlete, very soft handle, no post game, poor defender/rebounder. We have seen a 6’9, slow release shooter - his name is Mark Donnal. The difference being that Donnal was actually more athletic and physical in HS.
Someone on Scout asked Brian Snow what he liked about Ivanauskus more that Towns he refrenced size, athleticism, ability to drive the ball, and toughness. So safe to say, two completely different opinions.
Someone on Scout asked Brian Snow what he liked about Ivanauskus more that Towns he refrenced size, athleticism, ability to drive the ball, and toughness. So safe to say, two completely different opinions.
I’m obviously not as credible in relation to Brian Snow, but that has to be one of the most absurd evaluations/comparisons I’ve ever heard in my life.
Am I crazy here guys, or do you agree? I mean, to claim Ivanauskas is superior to Towns in any facet of the game is mindboggling to me based on the old and new film I’ve seen…
Did a bit more digging on Ivanauskas - came up with a bit more film from December 2014. He just doesn't impress me, his shot release is very slow, below average/poor athlete, very soft handle, no post game, poor defender/rebounder. We have seen a 6'9, slow release shooter - his name is Mark Donnal. The difference being that Donnal was actually more athletic and physical in HS.
How can you claim to recognize all of these deficiencies in his game? The 2 clips you posted are comprised of brief highlights that only show a couple of defensive sequences / rebounding opportunities.
I agree that his release is slow (and has an odd hitch) and he doesn’t look very fleet of foot, but how can you so conclusively say that he has no post game and is a poor defender/rebounder? I haven’t seen any more clips than you, but I’ve read more than once that he has a good post-up game and is an adequate rebounder. That doesn’t mean it is true, but people who have seen him more than you (and do it for a living) think it is.
Also, your comparison to Donnal is way off-base. First, Donnal is a 5, and only a 5 in JB’s offense. He is not a good enough shooter from range and cannot put the ball on the floor (he can’t rebound well or play good post defense either, but that’s a different argument). No one who ever saw Donnal in HS said he could put the ball on the floor and get to the basket. Heck, people who thought he could be a threat from range were merely projecting–that wasn’t part of his game in HS.
Ivanauskas is a 4 in JB’s offense. He’s a good shooter, he can put the ball on the floor reasonably well, and looks to have a high basketball IQ.
Look, I don’t think we need Ivanauskas, either. I, like you, would like to upgrade our athleticism and add a creator / slasher. But that doesn’t make it right to draw sweeping, unflattering conclusions unsupported by video evidence.
Did a bit more digging on Ivanauskas - came up with a bit more film from December 2014. He just doesn't impress me, his shot release is very slow, below average/poor athlete, very soft handle, no post game, poor defender/rebounder. We have seen a 6'9, slow release shooter - his name is Mark Donnal. The difference being that Donnal was actually more athletic and physical in HS.
How can you claim to recognize all of these deficiencies in his game? The 2 clips you posted are comprised of brief highlights that only show a couple of defensive sequences / rebounding opportunities.
I agree that his release is slow (and has an odd hitch) and he doesn’t look very fleet of foot, but how can you so conclusively say that he has no post game and is a poor defender/rebounder? I haven’t seen any more clips than you, but I’ve read more than once that he has a good post-up game and is an adequate rebounder. That doesn’t mean it is true, but people who have seen him more than you (and do it for a living) think it is.
Also, your comparison to Donnal is way off-base. First, Donnal is a 5, and only a 5 in JB’s offense. He is not a good enough shooter from range and cannot put the ball on the floor (he can’t rebound well or play good post defense either, but that’s a different argument). No one who ever saw Donnal in HS said he could put the ball on the floor and get to the basket. Heck, people who thought he could be a threat from range were merely projecting–that wasn’t part of his game in HS.
Ivanauskas is a 4 in JB’s offense. He’s a good shooter, he can put the ball on the floor reasonably well, and looks to have a high basketball IQ.
Look, I don’t think we need Ivanauskas, either. I, like you, would like to upgrade our athleticism and add a creator / slasher. But that doesn’t make it right to draw sweeping, unflattering conclusions unsupported by video evidence.
Donnal couldn’t shoot the ball from range in HS?
Invanauskas can put the ball on the floor?
And you say my contentions are not supported by video evidence…you must think Seth Towns is NBA ready if you think that highly of Ivanauskas
You lost any credibility you could possibly have…carry on
Did a bit more digging on Ivanauskas - came up with a bit more film from December 2014. He just doesn't impress me, his shot release is very slow, below average/poor athlete, very soft handle, no post game, poor defender/rebounder. We have seen a 6'9, slow release shooter - his name is Mark Donnal. The difference being that Donnal was actually more athletic and physical in HS.
How can you claim to recognize all of these deficiencies in his game? The 2 clips you posted are comprised of brief highlights that only show a couple of defensive sequences / rebounding opportunities.
I agree that his release is slow (and has an odd hitch) and he doesn’t look very fleet of foot, but how can you so conclusively say that he has no post game and is a poor defender/rebounder? I haven’t seen any more clips than you, but I’ve read more than once that he has a good post-up game and is an adequate rebounder. That doesn’t mean it is true, but people who have seen him more than you (and do it for a living) think it is.
Also, your comparison to Donnal is way off-base. First, Donnal is a 5, and only a 5 in JB’s offense. He is not a good enough shooter from range and cannot put the ball on the floor (he can’t rebound well or play good post defense either, but that’s a different argument). No one who ever saw Donnal in HS said he could put the ball on the floor and get to the basket. Heck, people who thought he could be a threat from range were merely projecting–that wasn’t part of his game in HS.
Ivanauskas is a 4 in JB’s offense. He’s a good shooter, he can put the ball on the floor reasonably well, and looks to have a high basketball IQ.
Look, I don’t think we need Ivanauskas, either. I, like you, would like to upgrade our athleticism and add a creator / slasher. But that doesn’t make it right to draw sweeping, unflattering conclusions unsupported by video evidence.
Donnal couldn’t shoot the ball from range in HS?
Invanauskas can put the ball on the floor?
And you say my contentions are not supported by video evidence…you must think Seth Towns is NBA ready if you think that highly of Ivanauskas
You lost any credibility you could possibly have…carry on
I’m shocked–shocked–that you didn’t respond to the criticism of your sweeping, unfounded conclusions based off 7 minutes of highlights, and instead launched a credibility attack.
Based off of his demonstrated ability to put the ball on the floor and get into the lane in the videos, not to mention the scouting reports of guys who get paid to do it (not some anonymous amateur), I’d say that he can drive the basketball.
I’d love to hear how you concluded that he can’t play defense, rebound, or post up. If you can conclude these things without actually seeing them on video, then color me impressed. Perhaps you should quit your “attorney” job and start your own recruit evaluation website.
Honestly, and I’m not even saying this to insult you, if you think Ivanauskas can adequately handle the basketball or block shots/rebound, it’s not even worth a discussion.
I’m going to take the high road here…I simply disagree with you. I respect your opinion, but I just find absolutely no merit in anything you say regarding this topic.
Brian Snow is in position to travel and watch these guys live so he has seen him recently for full games. I trust Brian’s evaluations because he got into many heated discussions about his dead on Zak Irvin scouting report over on that board, but based on the available highlights, I was surprised at his commentary. I am somewhere in the middle of MattD and Brian with my thoughts on his tape, but would lean MattD’s way if I was forced to.
Can’t wait to read the eval from whomever was watching him live is all I can say.
Brian Snow is in position to travel and watch these guys live so he has seen him recently for full games. I trust Brian's evaluations because he got into many heated discussions about his dead on Zak Irvin scouting report over on that board, but based on the available highlights, I was surprised at his commentary. I am somewhere in the middle of MattD and Brian with my thoughts on his tape, but would lean MattD's way if I was forced to.
Can’t wait to read the eval from whomever was watching him live is all I can say.
You wouldn’t get into so many disputes on here if you simply defended your viewpoints rather than launch attacks with an air of indignation.
I don’t know if Ivanauskas is a good defender and rebounder because the 2 clips don’t show that aspect of his game. He’s probably not a great defender because he is not very athletic, but that doesn’t preclude him from being a good rebounder.
And the ability to adequately handle the basketball is all relative. I think he can handle the basketball well enough to be a 4 in JB’s offense. Again, there isn’t much to go on in the clips, but it looks like he has the ability to drive past hard close-outs and looks comfortable handling the ball on the perimeter. I’d imagine his ball handling is similar to Irvin and better than Dawkins. It would be a problem if we expected him to initiate the offense or run PnR, but he wouldn’t do that.
Based on the film I’ve seen (caveats for sample size), I don’t think his ballhandling is even near the level of Irvin or Dawkins in HS, that’s why it’s not even worth debate. In any event, we’ll just agree to disagree
Here is something on him from Scout and Brian Snow from October. Has already visited Wisconsin and UCLA is interested. Scouting report is interesting because his highlight doesn’t seem to showcase much of what is said here besides his low release:
“It is a disappointing class in terms of talent for the state of Illinois in 2016. Usually, Illinois has one if not two or three blue chip recruits who everybody in the country wants. That is just not the case in 2016, so there has been a major question regarding who will emerge as the best prospect in the class in the state.
After seeing him this weekend at the NY2LA Future Stars Showcase, I think that answer might be Rapolas Ivanauskas. Ivanauskas is not someone I saw over the summer and it’s tough to get a great evaluation in a camp setting, but there is no doubting his talent.
Ivanauskas is right around 6-foot-8 and about 200 pounds with toughness and very nice athleticism. At this point he is more athletic than he is skilled, but his skill level is not bad. Ivanuaskas can handle the ball for his size, is a good passer and is a decent shooter, though his release is very slow.
With a little refinement there is no reason to think that Ivanauskas won’t be a lock high-major recruit that nearly every program in the Midwest is after. Right now he is emerging as the best in the class in the state of Illinois, and is someone who will definitely be in the mix for top 100 status when the rankings are next updated.”
— Brian Snow
Another article about him says the same thing. Ivanauskas’ ranking is based off his play at camp and his interest from schools. Iowa and Northwestern have offered and there is interest from WI and UM. Don’t know what to believe, my eyes or the “experts.”
One thing about the above article is that there is talk about Ishmael El-Amin (Yes, Khalid’s son) as a high major lock. I coach against him and he is probably the 5th or 6th best PG in the 2017 class in MN. Scout has him ranked in the top 50 in the country. Laughable.
Brian Snow thinks he’s athletic? I am truly perplexed at that. I would love to see some more film. He may very well have great skill/athleticism, but the film we’ve seem simply does not display those attributes.
MattD, what evidence is there that Ivanauskas has no post game and is a poor defender/rebounder?
Where is the evidence that he’s a high IQ player?
Generally speaking, if a player is good, or even adequate in a given facet of the game the highlights will include that given attribute in order to make the player more marketable. It’s the reason why we seen highlights of Kam burying jumpers in HS despite the fact that he can’t shoot a lick. The absence of film in a given area generally indicates the player lacks that attribute. The fact that a 6’8 player has no post/rebounding/block highlights is most likely indicative that he is not proficient in those areas