Win against SMU and we are national champs!
Win against SMU and we are national champs!
You are starting to get it, I knew you would come around.
The disturbing thing is that you are actually serious.Win against SMU and we are national champs!You are starting to get it, I knew you would come around.
The disturbing thing is that you are actually serious.Win against SMU and we are national champs!You are starting to get it, I knew you would come around.
What’s your deal??
Matt, I wish I had been around to see your reaction when the team started 1-6 in conference play in 2010/2011. You must have been stalking Beilein on campus. For a guy who says past performance does not dictate future results, you are sure holding on to those losses to EMU and NJIT as if they will dictate the rest of the year, as opposed to say a win over Syracuse and a last second loss to undefeated and highly ranked Nova.Chezaroo - get a grip, dude. “Not very talented” would be when you have a roster of guys like K’len Morris, Anthony Wright, Ron Coleman, Jarrett Smith, Jevon Shepard, and Kendrick Price. We have several talented guys on this team - Levert, Irvin, Walton, Chatman and Doyle for starters. Again, you just saw them lose to a team with several 5 star recruits, several of whom are JUNIORS in their third year of playing major minutes. Oh, and Stanley Johnson, a five star elite freshman. Do you think that just maybe, if our all juniors were still here (Nik, Mitch, Glenn), that game might have been a very good one?
By the way, as we have seen, players do improve under this coaching staff. And as far as all the negative energy about Duncan Robinson before he’s ever played a game, we are currently missing a lot of OPEN shots. Getting " just a shooter" is not a negative. Anyone who has watched one iota of college basketball should understand that elite shooters (hopefully DR is one - seems like there’s a solid chance) can be extremely valuable.
Just looked at the schedule again and I think 11-7 in Big Ten play, possibly 10-8. I have road wins over NW, Rutgers and PSU, and a home loss to Wisconsin.
A reminder, again - we were also 6-4 last year at this time, with a blowout road loss to Duke. Yes, last year’s team had more talent - that’s why no one is predicting 15-3 in the Big Ten. But it’s hardly time to throw in the towel, though of course for some of you apparently anything short of perfection is unacceptable. </blockquote
You can’t talk about all the talent we lost and then rely on last year’s team record in conference play at the same time. This is not last year’s team by a long shot so the fact that they rallied after a 6-4 start is totally irrelevant.
Hail - obviously you and I take jabs at each other from time to time, a majority of which are in a half joking manner..........I've had private, serious discussions with you to know that you are knowledgeable and more objective than what you lead on at times.You have been noticeably absent…what’s your take on the where things stand with the team?
My take is that our three most talented bigs are all freshmen and none of them really have much talent. I knew that this was going to be a weakness going in, but never thought it would be THIS devastating of a weakness. It’s like Michigan is playing 3 on 5 at times because 1) On defense, anything in the paint goes for an easy basket and 2) On offense, the guards are forced to take bad shots / bad passes because the bigs are so outmatched. I hope that 1 of the three freshman can give us freshman Jordan Morgan level production by February, but even that is appearing unlikely. If One of them could do that, I could see this team going ~10-8 still.
The lack of talent going forward is worrisome. If LeVert leaves, which I think is still probable, this team is going to be mind-numbingly underwhelming next season.
For me personally, I think if Chatman were as good as advertised (I thought he would be instant impact…I was definitely wrong in my projection), I think our lack of production from the 5 spot would be moot, or severely mitigated at minimum. He’s so bad offensively that it’s hard to keep him on the court to be honest. I honestly don’t think JB has many choices…at this point I would try rolling the dice with Dawkins. He may not be comfortable handling the ball, but he doesn’t look completely lost either.
Yeah, Chatman’s struggles have been the frustrating. I still think he at least has a switch that can turn on at some point- though that may just be homerish hope. It’s really been a perfect storm as of late. I don’t think any of us were expecting this class to be full of contributors, but it was hard to predict getting basically no contribution.
I never imagined Chatman to be a 35%+ shooter from 3, but I did think he would be capable of knocking down the elbow jumper off a screen in much the same way we used GR3 last year…he made that shot in HS. I thought he would be more of a 25-30% shooter from distance. His lack of production, and just generally looking overwhelmed, has been mindboggling to me.
Hail - obviously you and I take jabs at each other from time to time, a majority of which are in a half joking manner..........I've had private, serious discussions with you to know that you are knowledgeable and more objective than what you lead on at times.You have been noticeably absent…what’s your take on the where things stand with the team?
My take is that our three most talented bigs are all freshmen and none of them really have much talent. I knew that this was going to be a weakness going in, but never thought it would be THIS devastating of a weakness. It’s like Michigan is playing 3 on 5 at times because 1) On defense, anything in the paint goes for an easy basket and 2) On offense, the guards are forced to take bad shots / bad passes because the bigs are so outmatched. I hope that 1 of the three freshman can give us freshman Jordan Morgan level production by February, but even that is appearing unlikely. If One of them could do that, I could see this team going ~10-8 still.
The lack of talent going forward is worrisome. If LeVert leaves, which I think is still probable, this team is going to be mind-numbingly underwhelming next season.
Unless Caris falls completely off the map ( highly doubtful ) I believe he will DEFINATELY make the jump next year. He’s had a front row seat to 4-5 players leaving early in his tenure and has to believe he’s right there with them. He tested the Eval process last year and has already had an injury scare. Returning with this same roster is not inspiring either. Of course he has holes in his game, but very few early entry’s dont. He’s thought of very highly by DX and would easily be a top 20 pick IMO. This roster going forward is going to really struggle as it exists today. It will be very difficult minus Caris next year, no creators at all. For recruits considering us, PT will be immediately available.
Yeah…unless we get Brown, it is really difficult to imagine improving as a team next year. This is exactly what I’ve been so fearful of the last 6-8 months…you don’t bring in legit talent, and all the momentum disappears…and you fade into the sunset.
These gloom and doom comments are silly. We won’t improve as a team? Under JB, the vast majority of our players have shown significant individual improvement over their careers. If Amaker were still coaching, I would agree.
By the way, something to chew on. We would all agree, I think, that Roy Williams and John Calipari are two of the most successful coaches in the business, right? And they both agree at a very high level? Yet, after Roy won his second national title at UNC, his team (after losing all its top guys) went 20-17 and went to the NIT. Similarly, just two years ago, Kentucky was an NIT team.
Last year, Tom Crean went from having a #1 seeded team to missing the tourney. This year, Jim Boeheim may struggle to make the tourney.
The point is, early entries can kill you in any given year - it happens to the best of coaches. The only teams that have been consistently elite in recent years have been Duke, KU, and Louisville.
That’s kind of the point…those guys re-stock with elite talent, so they can withstand early entries…us, not so much.
Sorry, both “recruit” at a very high level.
To demonstrate this, UNC made the NIT in 2009-2010, but their 2010 incoming class featured Harrison Barnes, Reggie Bullock, and Kendall Marshall, all 3 of which were elite HS players…so it was easy for UNC fans to see that 09-10 was just a minor bump in the road en route to more elite years. Compare that to UM, where we lost all of our impact players from 14, and replace them with…Duncan Robinson. This is why 16 is basically make or break, and I’m becoming less optimistic by the day if I’m being honest.
But that is the point - sometimes you get caught off guard and can’t restock as quickly as you would like. If we don’t restock in 2016, that’s a clear issue. Until then, we’re in the same predicament that many high caliber programs have faced.
We’re not going to lose “all” our impact players unless you don’t consider Walton and Irvin impact players. All of Walton, Irvin, Wilson, and Chatman were top 75 recruits. It’s not like all our strong recruits will be gone. Now, if those guys don’t develop, that’s an entirely different issue.
If we don’t land some elite guys in 2016, then I think we should and will go back to our old strategy of focusing our efforts on lower ranked guys who we think have elite ability - recruits like Burke, Hardaway and Stauskas. No teams like Duke or Kentucky were recruiting any of those guys, though they should have been. In 2014, I’m sure we get Jordan Barnett if we offer, in 2015, I’m sure we could have had guys like Ahrens and McQuaid, and in 2016 probably Kyle Guy and Moyer. And what’s that other kid we see film on once in awhile, Frankie Hughes? If we miss on Battle and Langford, we probably turn the heat up on him and then target guys like that going forward.
If we do that, what we’re likely to see is: (1) easier recruiting battles; (2) our kids staying in school longer; and (3) recruits who are less focused on immediate playing time. With that said, if we go that route, our talent evaluation will have to be very strong. To date, it has been - see Morris, Burke, Hardaway, Stauskas, Levert - none were top recruits, all were stars. But every once in awhile you miss, too - Smote wasn’t a star (though it was probably more between his ears than his talent level), neither was Brundidge, neither was LLP.
Well if you get all upper tier players, every class, you don’t have to worry about hypotheticals and getting caught “off guard”…whatever that means. You literally have to assume every player you sign is going to leave after 1-2 years…that is the current structure of early entry. Basically, no excuses, coaches no good and well that kids are bolting after 1 good year in most cases, and recruiting should be adjusted accordingly.
To demonstrate this, UNC made the NIT in 2009-2010, but their 2010 incoming class featured Harrison Barnes, Reggie Bullock, and Kendall Marshall, all 3 of which were elite HS players...........so it was easy for UNC fans to see that 09-10 was just a minor bump in the road en route to more elite years. Compare that to UM, where we lost all of our impact players from 14, and replace them with...............Duncan Robinson. This is why 16 is basically make or break, and I'm becoming less optimistic by the day if I'm being honest.
I’m surprised you could actually become less optimistic. Didn’t think it was possible.
To demonstrate this, UNC made the NIT in 2009-2010, but their 2010 incoming class featured Harrison Barnes, Reggie Bullock, and Kendall Marshall, all 3 of which were elite HS players...........so it was easy for UNC fans to see that 09-10 was just a minor bump in the road en route to more elite years. Compare that to UM, where we lost all of our impact players from 14, and replace them with...............Duncan Robinson. This is why 16 is basically make or break, and I'm becoming less optimistic by the day if I'm being honest.I’m surprised you could actually become less optimistic. Didn’t think it was possible.
I love you too! Go Blue!
We’re never going to get all upper tier players. The only teams that do that consistently are UK, KU, UNC (other than the example I gave above), and Duke. We did, once, recruit at that level - see Martin, Ed. Three of those four are dirty programs, and Duke is Duke. If that’s your goal, you’ll literally never be happy with Michigan basketball no matter who the coach is, because we’ll never allow our coach to be Calipari.