Fine with general comments on bench importance going forward, but last year specifically, we had guys playing 35-40m consistently, and gave up leads at end of games/got blown out in overtimes consistently. Can’t imagine depth had nothing to do with that.
Having said that, if you are specifically referring to the National Championship game, I would likely have to agree re: Trey.
That should have been true re: Trey, but hard to say Spike didn’t compensate in that particular game. As a result, we dodged that particular bullet.
Fine with general comments on bench importance going forward, but last year specifically, we had guys playing 35-40m consistently, and gave up leads at end of games/got blown out in overtimes consistently. Can't imagine depth had nothing to do with that.
Less to do with fatigue and more to do with not having a healthy player on the team that can create a quality shot against a half court defense.
A lot of people say the auto bench is justifiable because if you have two fouls the opponent will run right at you to get that third foul. But if they know you will auto bench on two fouls, they can run right at you once you’ve picked up one. Definitely something to use strategically based on the situation rather than using it every time on “principle.”
That *should* have been true re: Trey, but hard to say Spike didn't compensate in that particular game. As a result, we dodged that particular bullet.
Maybe true. But if I could go back and do it all over again, a full game of Trey would have been interesting to see. Either way, if Spike ever marries Kate Upton down the road - he’ll owe JB for that one.
We didn’t lose because of foul trouble, we lost because of JB. He essentially fouls players out by default.
I see on this forum that a number of people think this way but I’m of the school where I think that stance adds considerably to the overall lack of fouls that we commit. So when it does bite us in the rear, I understand where JB is coming from on not being flexible. That was my coach in H.S. as well and it definitely got in your head once you got that first foul.
Having said that, if you are specifically referring to the National Championship game, I would likely have to agree re: Trey.
Im not a big fan of the auto bench but it really bugged me in the NC. After Spike went nuts he started to tire out and was getting killed on D. We really could have used Burke back in the game for the last few minutes of the first half when the game completely turned.
Or we could have just got over a couple screens and not let Hancock go off.
BTW, my expectations now that Levert is back is top 2-3 in the conference and top 3-4 seed. No less. This team will have more experience that any JB team has ever had and that’s huge. This team definitely has FF potential.
I'm with Jeff Van Gundy.............the bench just doesn't mean all that much, UNLESS you get in foul trouble. Even moreso in college, since the game is only 40 minutes are we're talking 18-23 year olds. That being said, I do think our depth will benefit us to the extent that we have a plethora of options (most of which are effective) depending on a matchup that allows for some flexibility rather than be forced to put a guy on the court by default.
Agreed…over the course of a whole season, the starting lineup and maybe your first and second guys off the bench make the difference, and after that, not so much. I’d take the team with the better top 6 or 7 and not much beyond that over the team that has less starting talent but goes 9 or 10 deep every time. A fit college basketball player should be able to put in 33-35 effective minutes a night with no problem from a conditioning standpoint, and if you get that from most of your starters, you don’t need a lot of fill-in.
Fine with general comments on bench importance going forward, but last year specifically, we had guys playing 35-40m consistently, and gave up leads at end of games/got blown out in overtimes consistently. Can't imagine depth had nothing to do with that.Less to do with fatigue and more to do with not having a healthy player on the team that can create a quality shot against a half court defense.
Do you actually watch games or just analyze film and look at stats? Spike was absolutely gassed towards the end of some of our games.
And have you ever heard of players “losing their legs” on their jumpshot after playing a lot of minutes? It’s not some wive’s tale.
Like…really? This kids are immune to tiring out?
Fine with general comments on bench importance going forward, but last year specifically, we had guys playing 35-40m consistently, and gave up leads at end of games/got blown out in overtimes consistently. Can't imagine depth had nothing to do with that.Less to do with fatigue and more to do with not having a healthy player on the team that can create a quality shot against a half court defense.Do you actually watch games or just analyze film and look at stats? Spike was absolutely gassed towards the end of some of our games.
And have you ever heard of players “losing their legs” on their jumpshot after playing a lot of minutes? It’s not some wive’s tale.
Like…really? This kids are immune to tiring out?
Whether Spike was gassed or not is moot because he doesn’t have the ability to create a shot late in the game against a defense that is set and playing hard. You are the official excuse/rationalization king around here…no matter what there is some valid/legitimate logic as to why we don’t get it done in some regard or another…it’s just in you. Reality is we didn’t win close games because we weren’t good enough based on talent, nothing to do with fatigue or ‘losing legs’
Fine with general comments on bench importance going forward, but last year specifically, we had guys playing 35-40m consistently, and gave up leads at end of games/got blown out in overtimes consistently. Can't imagine depth had nothing to do with that.Less to do with fatigue and more to do with not having a healthy player on the team that can create a quality shot against a half court defense.Do you actually watch games or just analyze film and look at stats? Spike was absolutely gassed towards the end of some of our games.
And have you ever heard of players “losing their legs” on their jumpshot after playing a lot of minutes? It’s not some wive’s tale.
Like…really? This kids are immune to tiring out?
Whether Spike was gassed or not is moot because he doesn’t have the ability to create a shot late in the game against a defense that is set and playing hard. You are the official excuse/rationalization king around here…no matter what there is some valid/legitimate logic as to why we don’t get it done in some regard or another…it’s just in you. Reality is we didn’t win close games because we weren’t good enough based on talent, nothing to do with fatigue or ‘losing legs’
Does this mean that opposing teams weren’t set earlier in games when Spike was making shots, and even creating them? Or does it mean opposing teams weren’t playing hard until late?
Not to mention that during our losing streak, we had to play Dakich and Lonergan every game and that was always when the other team went on a nice run.
I think it’s pretty well understood that most teams clamp down on D late in games in crunch time. Offenses simply can’t execute as easily as they might have later in the game. Reality is that a team with Caris and Walton is better than a team without, even if they logged 35+ minutes. Save the BS fatigue excuses, because that’s all that it is…excuses. Once those 2 went down we simply didn’t have the talent and I think most people know that.
I think it's pretty well understood that most teams clamp down on D late in games in crunch time. Offenses simply can't execute as easily as they might have later in the game. Reality is that a team with Caris and Walton is better than a team without, even if they logged 35+ minutes. Save the BS fatigue excuses, because that's all that it is.....excuses. Once those 2 went down we simply didn't have the talent and I think most people know that.
Who ever said that a team with Caris and Derrick wasn’t better than a team without, even if they logged 35+ minutes? Answer: Nobody–that’s your straw man. And who ever said we weren’t talent shy without those two players? Again, nobody. But if you think that Spike playing 39 minutes a game at point guard and dominating the ball on offense as he was forced to do with the personnel we had left didn’t get tired, especially on at least one hip which required surgery, and maybe two, and that it didn’t show on even wide open shots he got late in games, then I honestly don’t what you were watching. Word to the wise–bs is not a synonym for I disagree with Matt.
I think it's pretty well understood that most teams clamp down on D late in games in crunch time. Offenses simply can't execute as easily as they might have later in the game. Reality is that a team with Caris and Walton is better than a team without, even if they logged 35+ minutes. Save the BS fatigue excuses, because that's all that it is.....excuses. Once those 2 went down we simply didn't have the talent and I think most people know that.Who ever said that a team with Caris and Derrick wasn’t better than a team without, even if they logged 35+ minutes? Answer: Nobody–that’s your straw man. And who ever said we weren’t talent shy without those two players? Again, nobody. But if you think that Spike playing 39 minutes a game at point guard and dominating the ball on offense as he was forced to do with the personnel we had left didn’t get tired, especially on at least one hip which required surgery, and maybe two, and that it didn’t show on even wide open shots he got late in games, then I honestly don’t what you were watching. Word to the wise–bs is not a synonym for I disagree with Matt.
I NEVER claimed Spike, or any other healthy body did not potentially suffer from fatigue. What I did say is that is simply not the explanation as to why we were losing/not competitive in close games. My point is that a potentially fatigued team with Derrick and Caris is FAR better than a team without. In a nutshell, fatigue wasn’t the factor, it was the personnel available. To say otherwise is misguided in my opinion. But carry on with the excuses
Fatigue definitely played a factor in those games, especially with Spike. The kid could barely walk in the tunnel after most games. Obviously there were other issues with personnel, but I don’t know how you can’t say fatigue didn’t play a factor in some of those late game situations.
Seriously, Matt, is it so difficult for you to admit that there can be multiple factors involved in losing? Lack of talent was a factor, and likely the biggest one. Fatigue was another. Youth may have been a third. Decisions by coaches and players entered in as well. It’s not making excuses to actually look at a situation with some nuance.
Fatigue definitely played a factor in those games, especially with Spike. The kid could barely walk in the tunnel after most games. Obviously there were other issues with personnel, but I don't know how you can't say fatigue didn't play a factor in some of those late game situations.
Very easy - if Caris and Derrick played the identical amount of minutes within the identical game, we would have been in better position to win. Bottom line, maintain the same scenario and just swap players, and you most likely have different results. This cannot be hard to comprehend, you can talk about whatever else you want, reality is we simply didn’t have the available talent irrelevant of fatigue.
Fatigue definitely played a factor in those games, especially with Spike. The kid could barely walk in the tunnel after most games. Obviously there were other issues with personnel, but I don't know how you can't say fatigue didn't play a factor in some of those late game situations.Very easy - if Caris and Derrick played the identical amount of minutes within the identical game, we would have been in better position to win. Bottom line, maintain the same scenario and just swap players, and you most likely have different results. This cannot be hard to comprehend, you can talk about whatever else you want, reality is we simply didn’t have the available talent irrelevant of fatigue.
Obviously with Caris and Walton they would have been in better positions to win.
But there were multiple games where even with the personnel out on the floor they were in positions to win and it seemed to be fatigue as one of the main reasons they couldn’t close it out.