Its beyonds absurd to say a clear gap between Coleman and Robinson doesn’t exist. Robinson is just a shooter while Coleman is a legitimate on-ball player with excellent footwork and pro moves.
I’d also bet anyone Robinson “is an instant contributor”…I don’t see him getting minutes until his junior year, at least…especially if a guy like Dozier commits.
Top 8 or 9? LeVert,Walton,Donnal,Irvin,Chatman,Spike,Dawkins,Doyle,Wilson,MAAR hmm
You say it’s absurd…fine. Coleman hasn’t given any real indication in the past 6+ months that UM is the place he wants to come. So regardless of how good you think Coleman is…does it really matter?
I don’t agree that Robinson is just a shooter. Also, what indication is there that Dozier will commit?
What else is Robinson besides a shooter? He is physically weak and a bottom tier athlete…I see a poised shooter who will give up points on D… a 6’8’’ Spike is how someone put it, which is fine, but a more dynamic guard is needed as a starter.
I’d be disappointed if MAAR/Robinson was UM’s rotation at the 2, year after next
Or maybe he’s another Gordon Heyward - another 6-8 “just a shooter” type JB recruited hard a long time ago when no one else was very interested.
In that prior discussion about JB finding under-the-radar recruits that turned into college stars, I’ll add Heyward and Klay Thompson, two guys who we recruited hard and barely anyone else wanted. Mychal Thompson begged UCLA to recruit his son, but they wouldn’t.
Good points and what folks seem to be forgetting is, this kid will have a full year working on his body and athleticism. Which leads me to 2 points:
Zak Irvin is not an elite athlete by any stretch and he just improved his vertical leap almost 5 inches and I can say from seeing him up close he’s added at least 10-15 lbs of muscle. In workouts I saw, he looked more explosive as well.
#1 being said, I’d expect to see Robinson to make significant gains as well in terms of strength, quickness and explosion. Will he become the next Rex Chapman? No, but he will improve physically. Add to that, this kid is a straight gym rat and I feel very confident he will put the necessary work in to make the above improvements as well as continue to hone his basketball skill level(shooting and handles).
I’m a Williams guy, been following the discussion on Duncan the past couple of weeks. Awesome kid that most definitely will work his butt off to be as ready as he possibly can in 2 years. I have no idea if he’ll be a rotation player his first year but I tend to think it’s more likely than not. He’s never going to be a great defender but he can be a good defender. Obviously offense is his specialty and the purity of his shot is just not something you see come around too often.
It’s funny to me when talking whether he could make the rotation, maybe you don’t realize it but you ready have a Williams guy in your rotation. Spike from accounts here was on his way to Williams when he got the late call to go to Michigan. He was a Maker recruit and had all but packed his bags for Williams. Spike never had the hype that Duncan did coming into Williams. People were shocked Duncan chose Williams and he delivered, with Maker gone nobody is that surprised that Duncan is moving up because he was too good to be there in there first place pretty much.
First, for those who have concerns about Robinson taking away a scholarship, we still have plenty for 15, Hatch, Bielfeldt , and Levert declaring early, and Robinson definitely will not scare away any potential 15, 16 wings. I want to be on record that we will continue pursuing a wing in 15, and certainly in 16.
Second, for those who question the talent level of Robinson because of he played for DIII. As a poster pointed out, Spike almost went to Williams. And like Spike, Robinson has played in a system similar to ours. However, if Robinson came out of high school as a 6’8 sharp shooter, he would’ve been ranked no lower than McQuaid.
Third, for someone who has concern about Robinson’s below average athleticism. As LA Wolve pointed out, his ceiling could well be Gordon Heyward and Klay Thompson, both not doing bad in NBA with below average athleticism. A redshirt year can easily bring Robinson to 205lb and add 4-5inches to his vertical.
The bottom line, Robinson will be a solid role player whose ceiling is not necessarily low.
Contrary to what you think, all of those guys are at least average athletes, and that is what distinguishes a guy like Robinson from McQuaid, Heyward, Thompson.
Also, people are citing Spike as if that supports their contention…for some perspective, we’re talking about a guy that averaged 3.3 points per game in 15 minutes per game. Now, scoring is not the end all be all…but I’m saying that even for a role player, that isn’t very impressive, notwithstanding the explosion 2 years ago in the NC. I like Spike based on the fact he has utility other than shooting the 3 because he can bring the ball up the floor and run the offense, but I’d like to see better backup PGs in the future.
Duncan Robinson update on the front page… Great kid and all he wanted to talk about was how hard he was going to work this year to make an impact next year.
I don’t think numbers always define a player like Spike. He won’t be a superstar (though he was for the biggest game of the year) but he controls the game and his assist to TO ratio is great. I think point guard is the toughest position on the team especially for Michigan. He does a good job when he plays and sounds like a good teammate and teacher for the young guys.
It’s tough to get back up point guards at this level since they can probably start at mid majors…we shall see.
Contrary to what you think, all of those guys are at least average athletes, and that is what distinguishes a guy like Robinson from McQuaid, Heyward, Thompson.
Thompson, by any measure, is below average in agility and bounce, but compensated by his length. Heyward is closer to average in his bounce, but still a bit below. McQuaid is probably average, but I never said that he was below average.
Spike might not have done much, but a lot more than Brundidge.
Klay Thompson is not a below average athlete. Agreed that he doesn’t have good verticality, but he is not below average in terms of lateral agility, which is paramount to defense.
Heyward has average verticality, but lacks the lateral agility, but is decent in terms of straight line speed.
Brundidge…why would you even bring that up, it actually works against you. Spike is actually a better athlete than Brundidge. Kinda weird to say that Spike is a better athlete than anyone, but in this case he is.
Going forward, creator is the obvious need, both at the PG and wing spot. Also, we really need a defensive oriented big man that can alter shots.Agree. - PG creator? I'm confident we'll get one in '16. - Wing creator? I'm confident we'll get one in '15/'16 (I'm thinking Dozier, Langford, or someone we haven't thought about yet). - Shot-altering big man? Teske. - Bonus? Leaf or Towns. You may think I'm silly for being optimistic and I'm fine with that. I think everyone can agree with you and Ben that we need difference-makers in '16. I just choose to be optimistic about it.
Can't for the life of me understand how easily that 2013 class came together with just moderate success on the court and since winning an outright big ten championship, elite 8 and ncaa title game, as well as 4 1st round picks over the last two years, it seems like such an uphill battle to get the more sought after kids to buy in and want to be in AA.We got very fortunate with that 2012 class on the heals of getting Burke and Hardaway. And I think since then, many will agree with me, that a LOT of college coaches started paying a LOT more attention to who Beilein was recruiting and how he was recruiting. And they started going after the same players. And more 4* and 5* players were interested in Michigan. And those two factors have made it that much more difficult.
The issue isn’t whether Thompson and Heyward turned out to be solid athletes - they did. The issue is whether, at the same stage as Duncan Robinson is now, they were solid athletes. If they were, I’d imagine they would have been recruited by some better schools than Butler and Washington State. If IU, ND and Purdue didn’t want Heyward, that says something. UCLA wouldn’t offer Thompson, even with Mychal Thompson begging them.
How about we just agree on this - whatever Duncan Robinson is today, it’s entirely possible he hasn’t reached his ceiling and can develop into a quality Big Ten player, whether that is the result of further skill development, improving strength and athleticism, or some combination of both.
Going forward, creator is the obvious need, both at the PG and wing spot. Also, we really need a defensive oriented big man that can alter shots.Agree. - PG creator? I'm confident we'll get one in '16. - Wing creator? I'm confident we'll get one in '15/'16 (I'm thinking Dozier, Langford, or someone we haven't thought about yet). - Shot-altering big man? Teske. - Bonus? Leaf or Towns. You may think I'm silly for being optimistic and I'm fine with that. I think everyone can agree with you and Ben that we need difference-makers in '16. I just choose to be optimistic about it.
Is Teske a shot-altering big man…I only ask because I’ve only seen a 10 second clip of him (if it’s that long)
He’s going to be a legit 7-footer and I definitely think that niche he’s going to feel. He moves pretty well but needs to add athleticism over the next few years, but I definitely think that’s his role down the line.
Add to that, this kid is a straight gym ratThese are exactly the types of players - Burke, Stauskas, Walton, and to a lesser extent Hardaway and even McGary - who have improved the most while at Michigan and been rewarded for it.
He's going to be a legit 7-footer and I definitely think that niche he's going to feel. He moves pretty well but needs to add athleticism over the next few years, but I definitely think that's his role down the line.
If he’s a legit 7ft, the need for verticality is minimized at the college level.
Spike is actually a better athlete than Brundidge.
We can all agree on that now, but no one said that three years ago.