When Okongwu was the 2020 draft pick, it’s a good argument for the fact that stinking in Trae’s second year wasn’t what started to pull the Hawks over the top. Trae kept getting better, just like Cade will. But it’s the Capelas and other players they surrounded him with that started to make the Hawks a good team.
I agree the Pistons still likely have a lottery team, but there’s a big difference between drafting in the top 2-3 and drafting 8-12 like the Pistons did for a decade. If Pistons are in that lower range is it worth throwing away a season for another KCP, Kennard, Sekou, Hayes, Drummond, Greg Monroe, etc.? At some point you need to start building a winning culture.
The hope is Cade is an all star, future top 15-20 player in the NBA. The next hope is that Ivey or Sharpe is a legitimate #2 player. Then between Bey and Ayton you’d have two reasonably solid 3rd and 4th pieces and you keep building from there.
Feel like it is really, really hard to justify paying a max for a center other than Embiid, Jokic or Towns. Bam’s new deal starts at $28 and is for a total of $160.
Gotta be able to round out a roster w/ an 18 million center someday, but in the meantime, you need to raise talent elsewhere on the team.
Ayton has improved his dFG% against the rim every single season and the Suns defensive ratings has increased each year since he was drafted. They funnel everything to Ayton and Ayton use his length, athleticism to alter shots. I project him to continue to improve and he’s worthy of a max IMO.
No I agree that stinking wasn’t like game changing or anything. was just making a comment that if the pistons stink I wouldn’t necessarily be worried about Cade. It wasn’t til the following offseason the Hawks brought in vets to try to win
and made a huge impact in last year playoff where he was the best player at times. He’s 23 and ascending. Besides by the time, he’s done with max, the Pistons have room to pay to keep their core like Cade.
To me, they have a good young core. It’s time for them to find a 2nd star via #5 pick and supplement them with good vets to fight for play-in games. If nothing else, they’re in the lottery if they fail next season. At some point, they have to start winning while their core is on the rookie contracts.
(1) Going after a generational talent in Wembanyama makes sense in a way that tanking in general may or may not. The difference between a guy who can win multiple MVPs and a guy who may only win one is massive, especially over the course of a career.
(2) NBA seasons are loooong. It’s pretty easy to suck even if Cade is a top 40 guy. More likely, Cade will be average to a bit above average in year 2. 2400 minutes of that is just not that hard to cancel out playing a bunch of young kids who can’t shoot. Jerami Grant’s combined age and talent means he’s not important for the next good Pistons core. You don’t have to start worrying about Cade until he’s into his second contract.
(3) I would guess there are a decent number of teams whose under age 24 talent you’d prefer to Detroit’s right now. This pick, Bey, Stewart, Lee, and Cade isn’t obviously the next good team yet. So I would keep tanking regardless of Wembanyama. But “tanking” here means playing that core. If you start to win w that core, that’s an outcome you’re happy with.
The odds of winning megamillions are the same whether you buy a ticket or not. (The odds are so small and there are a couple instances of a winner who was given a ticket as a gift.) Ok, tankathon odds are better than megamillions … but still.
What about winning culture? I think there’s something to be said for winning culture and growing winning players internally.
Ok, so the EV might be up. With a full tank, you have a 14% chance at No 1. But, is there an opportunity cost in not really trying to develop a winning culture?
I’m just curious, how would “building a winning culture” differ from what they did last year? They played hard. Cade missed time with a pre-season injury, a covid protocol, and another little bang up. Bey played 82 games. Stewart played 71…the only guy I can think of that really got “shut down” was Grant.
Should they sign Brunson (probably $25+ mil a year)? Offer Lavine a max? Make an offer sheet to Ayton (probably a max?), or Sexton (maybe high teens?) or Miles Bridges (probably around Brunson’s price)?
For the record: I’d like to see (at low costs) more attention to putting together players who can work together. They had no shooting and consequently miserable spacing whenever Olynyk wasn’t on the floor. I like Kelly, and he should keep playing, but I think they should try to find some more guys who can spread things out for Cade (and the incoming rookie guard?).
It might not. I didn’t follow that closely. But, it felt like they’d get on a little winning streak and then sit a couple guys for a few games. It could be that I took all the posts I read about trying to stay in the worst 3 and projected onto the team dynamics. But, do the players have a sense that the team is trying to stay in the worst 3? I do think culture matters. I don’t think culture is easy to build. How do you get the players in that winning mindset, winning play mindset? Also, winning in pressure games when it matters? I think trying to build a winning culture is an affirmative, attainable goal. Planning around a 14% chance of a future event is not really something that the players and team can control, so I’m not sure about that being the strategy.
I think they should set a goal of making the playoffs next year. But I don’t necessarily think they should use their cap space this offseason. It might be worth saving it for next off season.
I think them using their space needs to happen in about 2 years (you want your pricey acquisition to come in before you have to give Cade his max), certainly no rush now.
Problem is that this is the year the Pistons have the advantage over the rest of the NBA in free agency. It won’t necessarily be that way in future years when other teams have more cap space. Only way Pistons are drawing a big free agent is if they can offer that player more money than anybody else. If other markets can offer the same or similar money, the player is not likely to choose Detroit, especially if they are still bad in two years. It is unfortunate that the Pistons cap space coincides with a down year for free agency.
There have been like 2 guys in the last 6 years who signed max contracts in FA - it’s just not how those guys move. Teams are so opposed to losing those players for nothing, they are almost always sign and trades. I really think the trade market for a disaffected star is how they do it.
What good teams in recent times have done so by adding a max FA with their cap space? The Nets who havent made it to a ECF, and Lakers(who had to trade all their assets for AD), and I guess GSW who were already great. It’s just not how you build a team these days unless you’re the place KD or Lebron wants to go to. Guys rarely sign max deals with different franchises. The key is accumulating assets by either drafting or that you can use for trades
The days of clearing cap space to sign a FA are gone. What it does bring is makes it easier to trade for a good player with a big contract
On Max Free Agents … my lady’s firm is hosting a gala tonight. Durant is the awardee. I’m trying to coach her: Beal is much better (and far less weird) than Kyrie. But what Wash has, with a number of moderately promising young players (I think they have four or five lottery forwards — maybe Juwan consulted?) and a borderline All NBA player, should be instructive for Detroit. Really need to grow the bench before you’re really ready to make a move.
