Hoping JB gets more opportunities to coach on the international scene!
Well, being elite is about prestige that’s built up over a very long time, much more than about “what have you done for me lately” success on the court. A few more good runs in the tournament, while they’d be nice, are not going to have us competing on a level plane with teams like Duke, North Carolina and Kansas, any more than a string of really good years would have one of those schools out-recruiting us in football. They don’t have prestige in football, and are not going to get it at any point in our lifetimes.
The fact remains that that most of the really elite recruits get gobbled up year after year by just a handful of schools, and we’re not one of them. There are exceptions every year, certainly, though a lot of those tend to be second-tier schools pulling in a huge recruit from their home state. There’s a question, certainly, of whether we even want to go there, whether we want to move more towards the one-and-done model (I don’t, frankly). But we seem to be stuck between that and the model of schools like Florida and Louisville, who always seem to have high quality upperclassmen in the lineup, and keep replenishing them. Beilein has yet to have a top-notch talent stick around through their senior year (like Kaminsky or Payne), and even juniors are rare. His players either develop quickly and leave, or don’t develop much at all.
Bottom line is that folks on this board seem to get a little over-optimistic about us landing guys like Thornton, Leaf or Langford. The feeling that we’d love to have these guys or that they’d fit our system really well seems to get muddled sometimes with our likelihood of landing them. While we may be good enough to get a look, it’s going to be very rare that we actually land the really big fish. It’s on guys like Irvin and Chatman, who are a notch below, that we’re going to have to build our success on.
I am realistic and are happy with recruits like JMo, Morris, THJr, Burke, Stauskas, Chatman and Irvin, but I think that we can land top 10 like McGary once a while, just not every year.
It’s a process. Just a few years ago, just getting on the list of kids like Thornton, Battle and Leaf would have been unheard of. Top 50 kids even, rarely gave us a look. Now we’re getting them to visit, more than once. Maybe we strike out, we’ll see. But we’ve moved way up the food chain.
We’re definitely doing better than we were before Beilein got here, although Amaker did pull in some pretty decent talent (but didn’t do enough with it). I just think we may have reached the glass ceiling as far as high-profile recruiting goes, and will find it very difficult to break through to the next level, no matter how many guys we send to the NBA.
We're definitely doing better than we were before Beilein got here, although Amaker did pull in some pretty decent talent (but didn't do enough with it). I just think we may have reached the glass ceiling as far as high-profile recruiting goes, and will find it very difficult to break through to the next level, no matter how many guys we send to the NBA.
Beilein has put to rest every other “Beilein can’t…”. Can’t close on top 20 prospects is all that’s left.
JB has done a great job with the program…not every top 20 will fit the culture.
MChem83 - our recruiting from 1985 to 1995 was as good as any elite program in the country. In addition to the Fab Five, we landed guys like Tarpley, Grant, Joubert, Rice, Mills, Vaught, Higgins, Bobby Crawford, Taylor, Mitchell, Ward, Bullock, Albert White, and Traylor - and we were the presumed destination for Kevin Garnett had he qualified. Of course, not all of those guys panned out (Bobby Crawford, Mitchell for example), but all were elite recruits.
Heck, the class of Jamal Crawford, Blanchard, Gaines, Anderson and Groninger was ranked as the #2 recruiting class.
In football, plenty of teams lately have turned on-field success into strong recruiting - Oregon, Texas A&M and Auburn all come to mind, and none of those programs have been historically as good as Michigan basketball.
We’re not some Johnny Come Lately basketball program. We have four national title game appearances in the past 25 years (more than any Big Ten team), and one title (just as many as any Big Ten team). I agree Duke, Kentucky, Kansas, UCLA and UNC are always going to be very tough to compete against, but I’m certainly not throwing in the towel - nor do I think Coach K coaches past 70, so we’ll see what happens there. And one day, Calipari will get nailed for cheating and/or leave for the NBA. Kentucky is a legendary program, but the coach matters for recruiting - Tubby and Billy Gillespie didn’t exactly kill it on the recruiting trail.
What JBlair says is exactly it. Typically if you recruit the skilled, shooters on offense, you sacrifice some athleticism. Obviously better athletes are better at defense most of the time, but often times are not as good at shooting. It takes a specific type of player to play in Beileins offense since he values shooting and protecting the basketball so much
If you can’t recruit skilled players that are athletic, balance between size, athleticism and skill would seem to be the key. I think JB is trending that way, and I love it
If this happens, I would assume we’re out of the mix for Murray:
HHC #1-ranked 2016 Jamal Murray on reclassifying to 2015: “It’s a possibility but it’s too early for me to make that decision.” #CdnBallers
— Hoops Hype Canada (@HoopsHypeCA) October 2, 2014
If this happens, I would assume we're out of the mix for Murray:HHC #1-ranked 2016 Jamal Murray on reclassifying to 2015: “It’s a possibility but it’s too early for me to make that decision.” #CdnBallers
— Hoops Hype Canada (@HoopsHypeCA) October 2, 2014
Why is that? Don’t you think we’d turn up the heat? I haven’t been following his recruitment that closely.
If this happens, I would assume we're out of the mix for Murray:HHC #1-ranked 2016 Jamal Murray on reclassifying to 2015: “It’s a possibility but it’s too early for me to make that decision.” #CdnBallers
— Hoops Hype Canada (@HoopsHypeCA) October 2, 2014Why is that? Don’t you think we’d turn up the heat? I haven’t been following his recruitment that closely.
From the film I’ve seen Murray looks to be strictly a 2. Too much overlap with Robinson. Dozier has much better ballhandling/court vision in relation to Murray. Long story short the Coleman principle seems to apply
Quick note on PG’s:
UK is making a HUGE push with the nations #1 PG in '15 Briscoe. He’s deciding soon.
I don’t think UK is an option for Thorton with Ulis and Briscoe on the roster. Would be big IMO.
Yes, a UK Briscoe committment may help our chances. However, I’ve heard some chatter that Dozier committing to UM may also weigh on Thornton. Not sure if I believe that or not, but certainly would be interesting.
Duke is still a threat for DT
If we get Thornton because Briscoe goes to UK and Dennis Smith Jr. goes to Duke, I’ll still be pretty darn happy.
I don’t give a damn how we get DT, if we can land that kid it will be huge. Has the ability to make average players good and good players great. A special talent indeed
I know where you heard the Dozier comment and he has since come out and said a Dozier commit would not affect the Thortons what so ever with Michigan.
Duke is not as much as a threat as UK or UCLA. Duke made Smith their priority. UM leads for Thorton.
I never said the Dozier recruitment had any influence on DT, don’t know how you extracted that from my comments. Simply said Murray would most likely fall off our radar if he reclassified to 15.
I don’t necessarily think we lead for DT, in the top group, yes…but I don’t think we are the outright leader at this point. Im becoming less inclined to believe he is coming here as time passes.
He is referring to my comment based on what I’ve heard. I am not implying you said anything to that effect.