The DeVante' Jones experiment

Trust Juwan. With the help of his assistants he will do what is best for the team and the program. I am absolutely sure that is what he is already doing whether we understand that or not. I am certain his number one focus is in doing what he believes is best for the program.

4 Likes

What Juwan thinks is best for the program and what is actually best for the program aren’t always one in the same. That’s true for any coach and any sport. It’s why every fan base criticizes its coaches - they don’t think the coaches are doing what is best for the program.

Why do fans instinctively circle the wagons when people second-guess the decisions of a coach? So weird.

3 Likes

I respectfully disagree with you.

2 Likes

So let’s say, hypothetically, that Juwan Howard benched Jaren Jackson Jr in favor of playing Ben Carter in a big game. Did Juwan do what’s best for the program?

2 Likes

Listen, first, you do NOT want to have this debate. Second, you can’t just make things up.

Seriously, we are talking about Juwan here, and I truly believe Juwan is motivated by doing what he believes, in both his heart and his mind, is in the best interests of the team and the program going forward. He has assembled an exceptional brain trust of highly qualified coaches to help and advise him in making those decisions.

Oh, and did I say, you can’t just make up a bunch of hypotheticals?

Probably best to drop it. I’m serious.

Man, @YpsiTuckyBoy is allowed to have an opinion. He isnt forcing it on you and if you dont want to engage in the dialogue, then dont.

Personally, I believe Juwan generally makes the correct decisions, but he, like everyone else, is fallible. This is a Michigan basketball forum and he wants to discuss how Juwan could potentially do a better job of minutes management which is fair and doesnt undermine the validity or authority that Howard has

7 Likes

I’m going to be nice and bow out. ThisYpsiTuckyBoyt guy addressed me directly, and said some things with which I disagreed. I wanted to say more, but I didn’t. he responded and I suggested he drop it, perhaps too firmly, not because he doesn’t have a right to an opinion, he certainly does. This is America, after all, everyone has a right to an opinion and to express their opinion. No, I suggested he drop it because I could see the direction this could go. But, let’s look at what occurred here.

I wrote an answer to Dirk about trusting Juwan. YpsiTuckyBoy answered my response to Dirk that we should trust Juwan and that Juwan has the best interests of the team and the program at heart, but, in doing so. HE answered me, but he turned it into a discussion about whether coaches can even BE trusted, including Juwan. I think the great majority of coaches can trusted, by the way, but that is something that we could discuss somewhere, sometime, maybe on the appropruate thread. I told YpsiTuckyBoy, “I respectfully disagree,” and he came back again with a hypothetical that is at best a strawman. At that point, it became clear to me that this “discussion” would be best if it was dropped. And so again, I, perhaps too firmly, suggested that he drop it.

I’m going to be gracious and stop in a moment because if this continues, it will turn into a debate, not about one’s right to an opinion, but about credibility and expertise. It will become a debate about whether or not Juwan, with his knowledge and expertise of basketball, in general, and of college basketball, the young men who play college basketball, and the basketball program at the University of Michigan has that credibility.

Further, it will become a debate about whether a random fan(s) on a sports message board has/have more knowledge, expertise, and credibility than our coaching staff. It will NOT become a debate about whether, on a sports “message board,” “social media,” as it were, folks have a “right” to express an opinion, they do, the first amendment gives them that right, but rather on the validity and credibility of those opinions.

I don’t think Dylan or anyone else on here wants that debate. So, I will bow out and leave this subject. Oh, and I apologize to all of you who have just read something that has gotten so far off topic. Some will agree with me, some will disagree, I’m pretty sure of that. Maybe more will disagree, probably so, I guess, and that’s OK. :wink:

Oh, as an aside, as to a debate about Juwan’s credibility, expertise and knowledge as our coach and whether or not we should trust him, if you want to have that discussion, I would be happy to engage in that discussion off the forum, in direct messaging. I will also be happy to talk, privately, about coaches and why I have far more trust in most coaches than I do distrust in them or more trust in most of them than I do for the fans who criticize, some would say question, them. Just to be crystal clear, though, once again, I understand that folks have that right. And, finally, I would be more than happy to discuss my own credibility to hold the opinions I have about all of this…if anyone cares. :slightly_smiling_face:

1 Like

Holy heavens. I’ll be back after the first of the year. For the first time, the negativity on this forum is taking away from the basketball experience instead of enhancing it. Never thought I’d see people going after Ernie, the consummate optimist and possibly the nicest human in history. They lost two games and the rotation isn’t set yet. No one has their role figured out. All of a sudden the world is falling and we’re throwing out hypotheticals about how Juwan would handle JJJ’s minutes?! Michigan has played zero conference games, has 3 McDonald’s all American freshman and a transfer point guard. Give them a month to figure it out. My goodness…

6 Likes

skipping over the past few posts…

The post Dylan put up today, particularly the video of Eli and Jones repeatedly finding the open 4-man (who was Isaiah Livers last year, and is Johns/Williams/Diabate now) to see them often pump-fake into harder 3’s, a pass, or an ill-advised drive, are VERY often just miss confirms lots of of what I felt…which is that the effectiveness of Jones as a PG while somewhat in his hands, has a large part to do with the players surrounding him.

11 Likes

Were posts deleted or something? Nobody went at Ernie. Someone had an opinion that he disagreed with. We can’t seriously disallow that lol. I feel like this place has handled the early struggles miles and miles better than other Internet forums would.

3 Likes

I agree. Caleb Houstan at least draws defenders so despite his lack of accuracy this far I’ll give him half a point, but we’ve been running out lineups with 1.5 truly good shooting threats. That’s not how you win big time college basketball games in 2021. Jones is certainly part of that, you can’t just ignore that he’s not a huge threat. But it’s not like it’s a Jones thing. It’s a lineup thing. I’m interested in seeing what adjustments get made.

3 Likes

Gonna go ahead and bump this thread after that UNC first half. No particular reason.

Can’t rely on transfer portal for PG, simple as that. Hopefully now that Juwan has Kobe, Frankie, Zeb, and Dug coming in next year we shouldn’t need one next season.

1 Like

Again, Devante is still pretty low on our list of issues

3 Likes

Yeah he’s a problem, but he’s one of a half dozen. Like, he’s a mediocre defender and is struggling to score, but if our forwards were Livers and Franz, he’d have 4-5 more assists per game right now.

4 Likes

I think the common ingredient is two fold. First, the transfer needs to have shown at least something against high major opponents. Mike Smith showed against Virginia and Wake that he could hang…Jones didn’t have any comparable tape. Chaundee was fine as a high major transfer.

Second, you need those transfers to play a role aligned to their skills. Smith was a pass first PG who we hid on defense and was the 4th or 5th option on offense. Brown was a spark off the bench after being a multi-year starter
Jones is being asked to do a lot more for this team…even if it is clear he isn’t capable of even matching Smiths skill.

2 Likes

I agree both the sentiment that 1) Jones is just one of many problems for this team and may not be the biggest ones and 2) he had severely limited our floor and ceiling

I think lacking a stretch 4 really severely magnify HD and Jones’ problems. While I don’t like Jones’ handle (or the lack of it for a lead guard), we can probably get by if we have wings that can shoot and space the floor.

Since we don’t, it make our PnR game esp our rollman a lot easier to defend. We need our lead guard to be a lot better in getting into various spots on the floor to either threaten to score or have any chance to run any offense, and Jones cannot do that with his loose handle and zero explosiveness.

We can probably survive 1 of these deficiencies (Jones or Johns/William/Diabate/non-lethal Houston as our 3+4) but not both. I’m clinging on my last hope now - for Diabate to develop into a more reliable shooter, but that take him away from rebounds and post game that is more of his strength. So well I don’t really have any hope…

2 Likes

I actually wonder if things continue to be this bad whether Juwan will break glass on Barnes (allowing Houstan yo move to the 4 at times) or Tschetter (as a shooting 4…even if he isn’t ready yet). I don’t think either are ready for this level and Kobe might not be either, but the roster construction is a mess with playing 3-4 non shooters at all times.

3 Likes

The guard play has been poor, but would be better with better floor spacing which, in turn, would be better with adequate outside shooting. Houstan must be a better shooter than what he has shown. The game hasn’t slowed down for him yet it seems. And Johns is passing up shots that he should be taking. Who are the shot makers on this team?! Dickinson is being hurt by the lack of spacing, no doubt, but sulking is a terrible look for him. I like the pace that Frankie plays at though his shooting won’t solve the lack of floor spacing. Juwan and his assistants are pros who can see all this.

5 Likes

Finally, #frankiefree